Arduino - Digital AC control system for '80 911

[kuehl]

Originally Posted by Discseven

This plan adds a good deal of work. Am thinking "finished product" will be more appealing than taking easy route.

Yes, perfection does take work and buckeroos, lol. Eon's back we worked on a 'total air' project. The control's prototype fascia, work by hand, was 1/8" haircell ABS, easy to cut, bend, mold. Later, waterjet 6061 (or your favorite flavor). Leather or leatherette, lots of colors to choose, or create your own brushed finish and black anodize (its an insert so you'll be fine with any texture and finish).

We had a working prototype back a few years with plenty of sensors, data, etc. I had it in my cab but it was a distraction; I'm an old man so old school analog blends well and works for me.

Keep us posted, sounds like you are having fun on the run.

I know Ron can't wait to get his hands on your final unit so he watch his videos.

[Rawknees'Turbo]

Originally Posted by kuehl

I know Ron can't wait to get his hands on your final unit so he watch his videos.

Griff, why you haveta' bring Karl's unit into the discussion?!?!

Mmmmm, videos in the Mighty Meatlocker Turbo . . . inappropriate (for some!) videozzzz!

[kuehl]

Sorry Ron. I always seem to forget consonants late in the day.
Here ya go.... "units" !

PS... Karl said he's going to put in a nav ap in the unit he sends you, something about coming in last in the local scavenger hunts?

[Rawknees'Turbo]

Originally Posted by kuehl

Sorry Ron. I always seem to forget consonants late in the day.
Here ya go.... "units" !

PS... Karl said he's going to put in a nav ap in the unit he sends you, something about coming in last in the local scavenger hunts?

Karl is more special than I thought if he is rocking plural style - a freaky freakazoind of nature (butt only fitting, since it's Karl were're talking about!)!

Karl will probably put in a nav app that autopilots my car to his house - that way he can slip me a roofie and then dig through my car for a/c secrets while I am zzzzzing!

[Discseven]

Talked to Porsche CNA months back about driving a 930 around the world... of course plan is for PCNA to sponsor---entirely. Film crew included. Suggested white, early mod 930 being Porsche-of-choice. No stickers of any kind on car---totally clean lines. Slightly tinted windows (so one can see occupants but cannot make them out---car is hero.) Stock appearance of car = essential. Early vintage... purposely makes statement of enduring Porsche quality. Circumvention is with standard maintenance only as in filters, oil change etc (even though 930 is clearly & intentionally punished at times.) Contract reserves occupant/driver rights. 15 months. 10 to plan, permit, crew & prep. 5 to drive. Told PCNA 930 required is in Norf TexASS. Whether PCNA grasps vision & has balls suitable for this dramatic journey pends. Is unusual propaganda vehicle but if Porsche 'gets' promo value...

[Discseven]

Originally Posted by FrenchToast

One option:

There are zillions of bezels that have already been designed and are still in production. Most are probably black plastic. From a printer display to the clock in a Ford Focus. Just a matter of selecting one that has practical mounting system and achieves desired texture/shape/finish, and an opening that matches your screen choices. There's gotta be something out there. Then select your display screen to fit.

Obviously you lose the customization abilities, but you don't need to put in the all the R&D hours to design a bezel.

Texture/shape/finish are all important as you mentioned Toast. Add to this the small dimension of the intended display's viewing area (2.26" x 1.7")... to maximize legibility of displayed content any bezel's opening has to be very-very close to these dimensions. To find a bezel that suits everything... not a simple matter. Best compromise...

4D's 2.8" product bezel fits Nextion 2.8 display viewing area exactly and has right radius corners to compliment Porsche's center console radius corners. While unproven at this point, I believe gloss black finish of this bezel will go well on black leather. Reason for being interested in alternative course is this bezel's downside: it's full plastic (so no touch screen ability as Nextion display unit allows) and only .7mm thick. Probably has to be back'd up somehow.

This bezel will soon be in hand. Whether it's usable can then be decided.

[Tremelune]

What's the goal you're trying to achieve? All I've ever wanted from climate control is three knobs and buttons for AC and recirculation:

1) Fan speed
2) Temperature
3) Distribution

A car's ability to effectively maintain an accurate (as opposed to merely consistent) cabin temperature is not all that important for comfort. As one drives, the desired temp changes over time. When you first get in the car, you usually want max hot/cold, and as you drive you'll adjust as things change (less and less over time as equilibrium is approached). Feet get cold (or hot, depending on the person), seats get warm, etc etc...A static temp setting of, say, 70°F won't cut it, even factoring in humidity (which is neat, by the way).

Perhaps I'm misunderstanding, but since you will necessarily be adjusting things as internal and external conditions change over time during every drive, what value do the sensors and computers add here over a few knobs and buttons?

Great work by the way, don't take this as a critique. I'm one part engineer that sees a code review opportunity and one part driver who thinks the BMW E30 HVAC system was the zenith of design...particularly when compared to the later "climate control" systems that continue to invade modern luxury cars.

[kuehl]

Originally Posted by Tremelune

who thinks the BMW E30 HVAC system was the zenith of design...particularly when compared to the later "climate control" systems that continue to invade modern luxury cars.

I think Karl want's to challenge the E46 climate control....... less the fresh air filter, heating regulation, compressor control, stepper motors and bus control, rear defrost, IHKA i.p.o, scanner to read the trouble codes, and the time to replace all the parts !

[Discseven]

Originally Posted by Tremelune

What's the goal you're trying to achieve? All I've ever wanted from climate control is three knobs and buttons for AC and recirculation:

1) Fan speed
2) Temperature
3) Distribution

A car's ability to effectively maintain an accurate (as opposed to merely consistent) cabin temperature is not all that important for comfort. As one drives, the desired temp changes over time. When you first get in the car, you usually want max hot/cold, and as you drive you'll adjust as things change (less and less over time as equilibrium is approached). Feet get cold (or hot, depending on the person), seats get warm, etc etc...A static temp setting of, say, 70°F won't cut it, even factoring in humidity (which is neat, by the way).

Perhaps I'm misunderstanding, but since you will necessarily be adjusting things as internal and external conditions change over time during every drive, what value do the sensors and computers add here over a few knobs and buttons?

Great work by the way, don't take this as a critique. I'm one part engineer that sees a code review opportunity and one part driver who thinks the BMW E30 HVAC system was the zenith of design...particularly when compared to the later "climate control" systems that continue to invade modern luxury cars.

Trem... Agreed. 1-2-3 and cold air is all I need too.

This Arduino project makes no sense unless one sees it as a creative expedition. Dealing with new materials & processes, sorting issues, learning a few new tricks along the way... it's all fine pasture. Ultimate goal & gratification is to deliver something John and I are able to call a quality outcome.

[Discseven]

Parts are arriving. First in is bezel (from 4D.) 4D display is acquired for bezel only---John prefers to program/sketch in Nextion display code rather than 4D. John's diligent participation... am grateful he's along for this creative journey. An excellent individual to collaborate with.






Arduino Uno. Is headed for cubby area.




7 Phillips screws… console’s out. (Not fond of liking interior of car better with this thing removed! This thinking puts immediate crimp in planning. Fortunately... is not a simple delete! There are considerable holes in carpet where this connects to tunnel. Dogged my own bullet!)






Naked AC control panel. Plan is to extend this facia down to bottom of cubby. Stock control knobs will remain. Center cut out is where speaker front-to-rear fader control was. That will be covered.




Exit for switches/wiring is seen at front of console when AC control panel part is removed. Vertical plastic part inside cubby at left has nothing in it---only serves to hold AC control panel up/in place.






Top tangs on existing AC control panel will be removed as these will not work when new facia fits top to bottom inside console. (New AC control is planned to slide in/out of console. Question is how to fasten unit without putting screws in facia.)

[Discseven]

If rear window reflects in display (from driver’s viewpoint)… bad news---screen’s content is useless. To “control” reflection, am tilting display’s top slightly forward (in car) in its mount. (If tilted forward too much, driver sees up through front windshield---just as bad as rear window reflection.) Target reflection = ceiling’s black headliner. Was going to wood carve tilted mounting panel. Decided to go with clay as positive mold > rubber as negative mold (from clay) > resin as final positive (from rubber). Reason… this path seems to offer more flexibility on route to creating a final tilted panel. Have never done this so… totally experimental.

Box for clay is exact measure of added panel area (minus leather dimension that will wrap around on three sides.) Release agent is spray shellac.




Air dry, non-shrink clay.




Tilt profile was drawn in Adobe Illustrator. Going through exacting process of building impression model from those drawings was considered but the time to do so was extravagant. Thought I could get profiles very close to what is needed by looking at drawings while sculpting clay. Is not an exact outcome but with some sanding... it will smooth out with a profile that's very close to the drawings. Important area here is primarily perimeter as display will knock most of this surface area out. (While 4D bezel window dimensions fit Nextion’s display area, I’ve yet to confirm a nice flush-fit between bezel and Nextion display. Am moving forward as if it those parts will fit nicely.)




On premise that clay would take considerable time curing while sitting confined in a box… I pulled the clay. Not a good idea. Clay stuck to wood in some places. Proceeding to separate clay from wood has caused both distortions and breakage. Broken bits have been reassembled. Distortions have yet to be sorted. (Shellac---and fact that I pulled clay before it was fully cured---does not work. Better “release agent” would have been to line box with Saran Wrap.) While this doesn't look like much here... once the black leather forms onto this and the bezel goes on, it starts to come together. (Would have taken pic but short on hands.)

[Rawknees'Turbo]

Looks interesting, Karl, butt am not sure how you can resist the temptation to leave the center console out of the car (and start your design over, as a result!). I really like the looks of the interior with that removed, and might do that with the mighty Turbo some day. Not that I'm trying to peer pressure you, or anything!!!

[kuehl]

Karl,
If you want to better understand "reflection"

Anti-Reflective and Anti-Glare
Technologies for Display Applications


Possible 3M solutions
3M™ Display Enhancement and Protection Films

[DRACO A5OG]

Yummy

Watching in anticipation Brother Karl

[Discseven]

Originally Posted by Rawknees'Turbo

Looks interesting, Karl, butt am not sure how you can resist the temptation to leave the center console out of the car (and start your design over, as a result!). I really like the looks of the interior with that removed, and might do that with the mighty Turbo some day. Not that I'm trying to peer pressure you, or anything!!!

Ahhhhh... OK. Let's sort out new AC control knob and display position Rono and I'm game---but not now Bro! Must be a return trip. Reason being, I want to put brakes on my detours as unfinished projects are stacking up (AC charge and second seat recover, ripped off torsion bar mount, windshield, chirping rear suspension... the list goes on.)

Originally Posted by kuehl

Karl,
If you want to better understand "reflection"

Anti-Reflective and Anti-Glare
Technologies for Display Applications


Possible 3M solutions
3M™ Display Enhancement and Protection Films

Over-the-top impressive data. TY CG!

Originally Posted by DRACO A5OG

Yummy

Watching in anticipation Brother Karl

Good to hear from you Brother Jim. Hope all is well in DRACOTOWN!


Arduino... mounted... in wrong position. Yeah, this is what not to do. Looking at this now I realize display panel would have to be removed every time Arduino is reprogrammed (given units inflexible data cable near the socket.) Since there'll surly be a number of reprogramming events to fine tune the system once its running, easy access in this regard would be smart to build-in now. Thinking this through on the fly... makes sense to leave data cable connected to Arduino and have other end resting in console's access hole. Minor adjustment.

No worries on perpetual reprogramming John!---I'll learn code.

[DRACO A5OG]

I am well Brother, just completed my 2 major journeys: 964 Cam Swap and 915 Gear Box Rebuild. Oh the Joy.

Now relaxin and enjoying the ride and watching the Mad Scientist at work

Break a Leg Brother!

[Discseven]

^^^ Nice work Jim. Did U open threads on those? Immediate curiosity... when you 964 cams, does that trickle down to timing refinement, F/A mixture, chip mod, change of dancing girls, etc... or is it plug-&-play??? (MS... HA! We're all grapes on same vine---you're just much smarter than me as I tend to tangle in the undergrowth.)

Data cable in place. Moronic positioning of Arduino for sure. I can wake up now.

[Jonny H]

How do you plan to power the Arduino?

[Discseven]

Just saw John's digital rendition of screen layout. Impressive piece of work John!

Ard is repositioned. Data cable now remains permanently connected to it. When not uploading, cable can stuff into front of console. Last bits---potentiometers---are now ordered. (One is for "Set Temp." Other is to adjust screen contrast. Been trying to find shaft that will fit Porsche knob without having to mod parts. May have succeeded.)

[Discseven]

Originally Posted by Jonny H

How do you plan to power the Arduino?

Plan to run power ON/OFF from stock fan speed switch. Have heard 12v needs to be stepped down to 5v for Ard. Also heard that Ard can be fed 12v and will sort it out itself. Safer route is obviously a step down. What's your take Jonny?