ignition switch bypass

[onestar]

my ignition switch doesnt work all the way it turns everything on except the starter it will hold the starter as in keep it going after i start it from the fuse panel but it doesnt engage it so i was thinking instead of trying to buy a new switch i was going to splice into the 2 wires the engage the starter and put i a button instead of the switch ill still use the switch to turn everything on just not to engage the starter. i was just wondering if anyone knew which wires i need to splice into so just the two wires that engage the starter or just a wiring diagram will be enough.
if anyone knows i will appreciate the help thx.

[Danglerb]

This is not a step in a good direction.

You need to add your model information to your profile so its at the bottom of all messages. Many of us are old and can't remember everybodies model info.

[onestar]

sorry about that forgot to mention year its 1978 928 i dont have much of a problem with electrics my dad is an electrical engineer and is helping me out on this it was actually his idea for the button it seems like the easiest and coolest solution for my ignition switch problem who else will have a push to start button in their 928

[Danglerb]

Originally Posted by onestar

sorry about that forgot to mention year its 1978 928 i dont have much of a problem with electrics my dad is an electrical engineer and is helping me out on this it was actually his idea for the button it seems like the easiest and coolest solution for my ignition switch problem who else will have a push to start button in their 928

The ones I have seen so far were all getting parted out at the time, but that's just two.

The problem with bypassing, it gets you past a current issue and makes sorting out all the future ones more difficult. Why not figure out what is really wrong and replace the parts? After so many farmer fixes it gets easier to junk it and find an unmolested car to start again from.

[Alan in AZ]

Sorry - its a really stupid idea don't do it.

Just get a new electrical switch for the ignition switch - you do not need to mess with the key parts - the switch just bolts on the back & plugs in... its easy and pretty cheap at about $60 or much less used.

The ignition switch cuts out unnecessary loads during starting - you need that.

Alan

[dcrasta]

you can jumper it at the relay.

Taken from the email-keepers list :

"You (along with every other 928 owner) should have a relay jumper switch in
the glove box.

Pull relay XIV (or the jumper that is there), plug the jumper switch
between terminals 30 and 87. Turn the ignition switch on, get the car ready
to crank (in neutral) and use the switch on the jumper to activate the starter.

Wally Plumley
928 Specialists


"
A 'relay jumper switch' consists of a momentary 20Amp switch, a length of wire twice as long as the distance from the CE panel to the center console (my switch hides in my center console) , and two spliced on male blade disconnects (these you plug into the CE panel). Follow the directions, and once you have the blade connections inserted into the terminals when you hit the switch the starter should spin (make sure you are in park or neutral because this bypasses the neutral safety switch).

I use a momentary toggle until I have time to take my pod out and replace my ignition switch. Turn the switch to 'on' and engage starter with the jumper switch.

[Alan in AZ]

Originally Posted by dcrasta

you can jumper it at the relay.

Taken from the email-keepers list....

Yeah - and as a test mode this is fine - helps debug and confirm what is wrong, and the solution.

Then when confirmed -> You replace the Ignition Switch

Really a push button switch for the starter is nothing like push button start on a modern vehicle... its not at all comparable...

After all you still need to put the key in and turn it as well...

Its actually really more of a throwback to cars before the late 1940's when the integrated ignition/starter key switch arrived on the scene and quickly became ubiquitous. Do you really want to make your car comparable to a 1930's roadmonster...?

Alan

[dcrasta]

Originally Posted by Alan in AZ

Yeah - and as a test mode this is fine - helps debug and confirm what is wrong, and the solution.

Then when confirmed -> You replace the Ignition Switch

Really a push button switch for the starter is nothing like push button start on a modern vehicle... its not at all comparable...

After all you still need to put the key in and turn it as well...

Its actually really more of a throwback to cars before the late 1940's when the integrated ignition/starter key switch arrived on the scene and quickly became ubiquitous. Do you really want to make your car comparable to a 1930's roadmonster...?

Alan

At least he can drive his car with this work-around.

I have this same workaround and I have been 'driving' for 4 months. I have the ignition switch on my desk, but its not a high priority for me at this time.

YMMV however this is a non-destructive easily removed workaround and does not cause any additional problems.

[onestar]

This is his Dad. thanks for all the input and advise. dcrasta you are right and that is mostly what we are looking for right now. I do have one more question to anyone who can give me the detailed specifications of the "green wire". I would like to by-pass (use another wire) this wire to verify this is the final issue to be able to start the car. We have replaced the 1. Coil 2. Ballast Resistors 0.4 and 0.6 both. Prior to replacing these parts the car would run with a max RPM of 1200 at full throttle. We replaced the fuel distributor and regulator, and the engine ran GREAT for about 2 minutes then just died out. We have had reduced spark at the plug sense then. now wanting to FIX the spark issue. Thanks again for all the help DAD

[MPDano]

Using another wire for the "Green" wire is going to be a tough one. I remember somewhere that somebody has tried and actually came close to finding a wire of the same specs but the problem will be in the connectors, I don't think you can even find the connectors, yet alone use the old ones again as they usually disintegrate just by looking at them. I know your trying to save money here, but it's one of those parts of the early 928's that just go bad with heat and time. Getting a new $100 wire will be one of the best investments for your Sons Car.

I'll see if I can dig up info on the Green Wire I've seen in the past.

[MPDano]

Here is my Write up on it. No testing though.

Green Wire Replacement Write-up?

Heres a great do this then do that write up on ignition. There is a small part on the Green Wire and running a Resistance Test.

SharkSkin - 16v Ignition Trouble Shooting

[Mrmerlin]

for the OP,
if your green wire is brittle and tan or brown dont bother testing,
it needs to have a new wire installed this will then let you move on to other issues.

The ig switch is also a replacement part now ,
there is no such thing as cheap Porsche and putting bandaids on things is fine for a Chevy but a bad idea for the 928..

Its amazing how replacing one wire can make the engine run perfectly,
and it will do so for another 25 years

[Alan in AZ]

Originally Posted by Danglerb

...The problem with bypassing, it gets you past a current issue and makes sorting out all the future ones more difficult. Why not figure out what is really wrong and replace the parts? After so many farmer fixes it gets easier to junk it and find an unmolested car to start again from.

I'm really with Dan on this.. its a pretty slippery slope... to a car thats unreliable, valueless and eventually beyond recovery.

Obviously some folks are OK with this 'fix'.. to me its just signals another 928 on the road to the crusher. Maybe its just not worth fixing it right...

Alan

[Rupesy]

I have a push button on my car and I like it that way!

[onestar]

thx for the input guys i just remembered that after the engine died i had switched out the distributor and the green wire. the one i had on at first worked and was in much better condition than the current wire. since im on break now i will have time to switch out the wires and try it, then hopefully that will fix the spark issue and all i will have is the switch problem.

[Alan in AZ]

The lack of interest in fixing things properly is making me quite sad...

I can understand looking for alternatives or deferral were this an expensive or difficult fix - but it really isn't either - its about a 20 minute job.

I'm obviously just on a totally different page here... I'll go drive my car to cheer myself up.

Alan

[Danglerb]

I think the problem is that its easy to get into 928 that you can't afford, and its like a sinking ship with people crawling around trying to stay out of water. If you want a cheap 928 you have to start with one that isn't already sinking.

Every time corners get cut fixing a 928 it makes the next repair more likely and more difficult. Its a slippery slope, the owner never gets to experience the full potential of the car, and the car is slowly ground into junk.

[onestar]

Originally Posted by Alan in AZ

The lack of interest in fixing things properly is making me quite sad...

I can understand looking for alternatives or deferral were this an expensive or difficult fix - but it really isn't either - its about a 20 minute job.

I'm obviously just on a totally different page here... I'll go drive my car to cheer myself up.

Alan

From Dad,

Alan please try to remember this is a 15yr old boy who is working on his first car. A car that he bought with his own money. He is now trying to get his car running, while maintaining his 4.0 GPA in school and on the High School wrestling team. If him trying to find a less expensive way to get his car on the road distresses you so bad feel free to send him the parts he needs to accomplish this goal.....

To the rest of the reply's thanks again for all the information your help has greatly appreciated, hopefully with the time and experience gained from working on this car he will be able to share his knowledge with the next young enthusiast.

[Mrmerlin]

instead maybe buy a toyota it wont have the expensive issues the 928 has and will require less maintenance to keep it running.

For Dad trying McGiver fixes for the 928 may work for the short term,
but will usually result in a visit from a tow truck when it wont start far from home,
the tow will cost more than a new green wire.

That said i can appreciate the fixing up of your new project whatever it is,
but please realize you have come here for answers to fix something that isnt working as it should,
and frankly installing the parts suggested will usually result in continued performance,
band aids will result in coming home on the back of a tow truck

[Danglerb]

Dad,

It doesn't distress us, we just know its a bad idea, with bad consequences.

The advice you are getting comes from the observation of dozens of similar situations and the various approaches taken to fix a 928. It is however just advice, so feel free to disregard it and proceed on any path you wish, it adds to our collective information and maybe things won't turn out bad for you as it has in other similar misadventures.

If he is 15 what is the rush, take your time and fix things correctly.