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Ken911's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
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there is a really good trouble shooting guide in the 84 to 89 carrera Bentley manual that deals with the alternator warning light circuit. which is common to both cars. It you are not getting the alt warning light when you turn the key before the car starts it will not charge the battery all the way. Thought it was BS until i fixed mine.

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88 turbo Guards red Targa slant nose, and yes I am a horsepower junkie, 3.4liter,7.5 to 1 JE pistons, Adjustable WUR, Imagine fuel head, 1 bar waste gate headers,allthe cis toys. Now apart to become the next EFI monster. fabbing my own intake, headers Individual throttle bodies, MS-3, pauter rods, Xtreme twin plugged heads, gt-2 evo cams cop's.
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Old 06-16-2010, 10:26 AM
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oh and I took in my Remanufactured Bosch starter that i bought in Feb. They refunded my money for the reman starter and i got a high torque one to replace it. works great.!!
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88 turbo Guards red Targa slant nose, and yes I am a horsepower junkie, 3.4liter,7.5 to 1 JE pistons, Adjustable WUR, Imagine fuel head, 1 bar waste gate headers,allthe cis toys. Now apart to become the next EFI monster. fabbing my own intake, headers Individual throttle bodies, MS-3, pauter rods, Xtreme twin plugged heads, gt-2 evo cams cop's.
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Old 06-16-2010, 10:37 AM
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I think the hi torque starter only has two posts - positive and switch. Where did you connect the third wire (the second yellow wire that goes to the middle post on the stock starter)?
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Emery

1988 930 coupe - Silver Metallic
3.3L w/GT35R, B&B Headers, RarlyL8 muffler, TurboKraft IC, Tial WG, tecGT based phased sequential EFI & ignition, Wevo shifter/coupler, ...
Old 06-16-2010, 12:26 PM
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that wire i believe goes to the cold start injector. it is only energized when the starter is turning. So on a stock starter the yellow wire energizes a coil that closes a set of contacts that supplies battery power to the starter motor and the cold start injector. So all you have to do is make a small jumper with a 5/16ths ring terminal and connect it on the bottom of the starter motor where the power comes from the solenoid to the motor. (if you look on the stock one in the picture above. It's the large terminal with the braided wire that goes to the motor.)connect that jumper to the yellow/blue wire. and Viola it works!!!! The main battery cable though barely reached I had to reroute it. the connections are on the top of the starter out of reach. So you have to make the connections before it's bolted in. Then tighten the nuts to hold in the starter then tighten the nut holding the battery cable to the terminal post. Hope this helps
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88 turbo Guards red Targa slant nose, and yes I am a horsepower junkie, 3.4liter,7.5 to 1 JE pistons, Adjustable WUR, Imagine fuel head, 1 bar waste gate headers,allthe cis toys. Now apart to become the next EFI monster. fabbing my own intake, headers Individual throttle bodies, MS-3, pauter rods, Xtreme twin plugged heads, gt-2 evo cams cop's.
2019 Silverado 6.2L
Old 06-16-2010, 01:28 PM
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update: ran errands in the car all day today even purposely ran the battery low and it fired up every time love the new starter.
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88 turbo Guards red Targa slant nose, and yes I am a horsepower junkie, 3.4liter,7.5 to 1 JE pistons, Adjustable WUR, Imagine fuel head, 1 bar waste gate headers,allthe cis toys. Now apart to become the next EFI monster. fabbing my own intake, headers Individual throttle bodies, MS-3, pauter rods, Xtreme twin plugged heads, gt-2 evo cams cop's.
2019 Silverado 6.2L
Old 06-17-2010, 05:34 PM
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That's good news! I added the info about the wire from the starter to the CSV to the sticky, under "starter".

Last edited by A930Rocket; 06-19-2010 at 03:10 PM..
Old 06-17-2010, 06:16 PM
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So far today I made the following progress:
- replaced starter with hi torque starter, used the jumper mod described in this thread. Starter works great.
- removed fan and alternator. Removed all leads and grounds and brushed, cleaned, and re mounted. I saw no issues in this space.

I am still stumped.

If I connect a positive jumper lead to the starter positive, and ground the other jumper to the trans, the car starts with the ignition key. Alternator light works, and I register over 14volts on the auxiliary battery so the alternator is working.

I notice if I do not connect the aux battery, but have the switch on, the alternator light does not light up and the CDI does not whine. Two more clues?

Does anyone know where the CDI gets its power from? Is there a starter relay somewhere, or some sort of relay that woudl prevent the starter from getting power to the 12volt pole as well as prevent the CDI from getting power?
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Emery

1988 930 coupe - Silver Metallic
3.3L w/GT35R, B&B Headers, RarlyL8 muffler, TurboKraft IC, Tial WG, tecGT based phased sequential EFI & ignition, Wevo shifter/coupler, ...
Old 06-19-2010, 11:25 AM
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OK, today I took apart the 14 pin connector in the right rear fender area.

On the female (engine) connector...if I connect 12v to positive pole I get power through the red wire which is PIN 14 I believe. So, I conclude the red main wire to the starter is a good circuit. Is this a good conclusion?

On the male side (car body) Pin 1, which is yellow gets good power when key is on. I believe this powers the solenoid when switched. So this seems good. Also, when I hit the key the solenoid closes, so I figure this circuit is good. Is this a reasonable conclusion?

This leaves me with the red wire on male side of connector at pin 14. I believe this is supposed to be powered all times when key is on, and I believe this would power the positive pole on the starter. Can someone tell me if this is a right or wrong conclusion?

Pin 14 red wire on male side does not seem to deliver any voltage to the engine. I assume it should. If correct then this is my first real clue to follow.

Does anyone know where that red wire comes from inside the car? For example, can I trace it from the ignition switch? Or is there a relay? I checked it on the battery end and it delivers voltage, so it seems my open circuit is between the frunk wall and the rear 14 pin connector.

Can anyone else help me with some advice or knowledge?

Thanks

I have looked at all the 14 pin threads and they have not helped me beyond this point.
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Emery

1988 930 coupe - Silver Metallic
3.3L w/GT35R, B&B Headers, RarlyL8 muffler, TurboKraft IC, Tial WG, tecGT based phased sequential EFI & ignition, Wevo shifter/coupler, ...
Old 06-26-2010, 10:40 AM
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Finally figured it out and car is running fine now.

I am ashamed to admit the root cause, but I will in case anyone else ever forgets.

When I took the car apart months ago, I wrapped the black lead from the battery up and tucked it up out of the way so I would not have to worry about it arcing or anything.

When I put things back together, I concentrated on the red and yellow wires and forgot all about the black lead. From below it looked just like one of the cables to the rear parking brakes or heater boxes. I finally put on my glasses and got undet the car again and traced everything, and discovered I had not reconnected this lead. Of course this is the most crucial lead in the engine bay, but I just had put it out of my mind.

So there you have it. Problem solved and the issue was the black lead from the body to the starter was not connected.

Thanks for all the suggestions guys.
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Emery

1988 930 coupe - Silver Metallic
3.3L w/GT35R, B&B Headers, RarlyL8 muffler, TurboKraft IC, Tial WG, tecGT based phased sequential EFI & ignition, Wevo shifter/coupler, ...
Old 06-26-2010, 04:38 PM
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Did you paint the starter? If so it might not be making a good ground where it mates to the transmission
Old 06-26-2010, 05:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s5uewf View Post
Finally figured it out and car is running fine now.

I am ashamed to admit the root cause, but I will in case anyone else ever forgets.

When I took the car apart months ago, I wrapped the black lead from the battery up and tucked it up out of the way so I would not have to worry about it arcing or anything.

When I put things back together, I concentrated on the red and yellow wires and forgot all about the black lead. From below it looked just like one of the cables to the rear parking brakes or heater boxes. I finally put on my glasses and got undet the car again and traced everything, and discovered I had not reconnected this lead. Of course this is the most crucial lead in the engine bay, but I just had put it out of my mind.

So there you have it. Problem solved and the issue was the black lead from the body to the starter was not connected.\

Thanks for all the suggestions guys.
Ya know, when you first posted this problem, that thought occured to me only because I did something similar the first time I pulled the engine. Ended up crawling around underneath and finding that one wire yet to be connected. Don't feel bad, you're the second person I know of to do that. The rest of them, they're keeping silent.
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Old 06-26-2010, 06:44 PM
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Black lead? I only recall 3 wires to the starter. The heavy red one and two yellow wires. There's a flat ground strap from the trans to the body. Has this been replaced with a black ground wire on yours?
Old 06-26-2010, 07:07 PM
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There is a large black positive feed that comes from the battery to the positive pole on the starter. Then there is a red lead that goes on this same pole and goes to the alternator. There is a yellow lead tha goes to a middle connection that powers some shut down delay sensors from what I read. Then there is a third yellow lead that gets switched power form the key and from the 14 pin connector in the left rear. This last lead is what powers the solenoid.

So, today I get to drive it for the first time since last fall! With all the problems I had with the digital WUR and then having the LSD rebuilt, I have not been able to drive since last fall. I'm thrilled. It will be interesting to see how the Leask WUR works out as opposed to the digital WUR I removed. Right now my idle AFR is about 14.1.
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Emery

1988 930 coupe - Silver Metallic
3.3L w/GT35R, B&B Headers, RarlyL8 muffler, TurboKraft IC, Tial WG, tecGT based phased sequential EFI & ignition, Wevo shifter/coupler, ...
Old 06-27-2010, 03:43 AM
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I was thinking all there was what is shown below, but the more I think about it your right, as the power runs from the alternator to the starter and then to the battery. I'd just forgotten about it. Besides it would be difficult for the lead to reach when my engine is sitting on a dolly in the pix.

I hate getting old...


Last edited by A930Rocket; 06-27-2010 at 10:57 AM..
Old 06-27-2010, 10:49 AM
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yep I did that one also lol i usually disconnect the battery then pull the wires off the starter then tape the exposed end then reconnect the battery so the door locks and alarm still works. while the engine is out. first time i did it though i remembered as soon as i turned the key and nothing happened.
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88 turbo Guards red Targa slant nose, and yes I am a horsepower junkie, 3.4liter,7.5 to 1 JE pistons, Adjustable WUR, Imagine fuel head, 1 bar waste gate headers,allthe cis toys. Now apart to become the next EFI monster. fabbing my own intake, headers Individual throttle bodies, MS-3, pauter rods, Xtreme twin plugged heads, gt-2 evo cams cop's.
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Old 06-28-2010, 01:24 PM
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Sorry to bump this up.


I have exactly the same issue. I need to jump start with a battery or booster pack to start the car.
The battery is showing 13.18v on a full recharge. Battery poles cleaned, 13.5-14v when running.

Start perfectly when jump start with no hesitation but just clicks when you tried to start again.

I alway's leave the motor running putting gas or else .

Any picture where the starter is located? I'll start with the black lead to make sure it's on.
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Old 07-09-2012, 06:51 AM
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If it isn't the thick cables on the starter motor how old is your battery?
When they are old and sulfated they can still show around 13 volts but the available cranking amps is so low it won't start the car.

The stock starter is plenty for a 930. It has an easier life on a 930 than any other car because of the low 7:1 compression.
Old 07-09-2012, 07:03 AM
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The battery still "looks" new but I think the ancient owner didn't really use the car for more than 2 years prior to the sale.
Weird that the car did'nt have any of this for two month and now I have to jump start after every shutdown.

I still can find where the starter is but I can't find some time to do it.

Thanks for you reply. Maybe the starting amp isn't striong enough to start the car it just clicks and nothing turns. When I but the booster pack it fires instantly.

I bring my 2 booster packs with me everywhere and pretty funny to start my car the last 2 weeks even after a good night at the restaurant looking in the hood and plugging it.
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Old 07-09-2012, 10:01 AM
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It was only the battery for future reference.
Was showing 13.18v charged and 13-14v when running.

Thanks for your help

Old 07-10-2012, 02:17 PM
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