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wondering on building a TT without the intercooler

the engine (unknown at this time) should make enough power to push a 70ish, 2000lb car around well. But, needs a no tail or duck tail only rear. Just thinking out loud here, nothing chipped in stone. Or, thinking on a water-cooled intercoolers? thoughts?
turbo breathing easy should beat a PMO/FI maxed out engine.
some must haves:
-twin small turbos
-twin plug
-electronic FI/engine management
-light weight
-bling (show and go, lots of polish)
-uniqueness
-good client "hefty budget"
-350-400+ shp

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Old 06-06-2012, 09:49 PM
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Max Sluiter
 
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You can do bent or split intercoolers that fit under a ducktail. It has been done on a few cars. I think you can also fit a normal 3.3 930 intercooler under a Burzel if you trim the shrouding way back.
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Old 06-06-2012, 10:58 PM
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Always liked the way RUF did on their CTR.
Nice and clean engine compartment, and will fit without any rear spoiler.
Oil tank need to go and upgrade engine with 993 oil filter etc
Been looking at this and found that 996 intercoolers might be used

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Trond R.
1979 930: Garret GT35r turbo, EFI, carerra intake, Link EMS, custom GT2 cams, 98mm JE P/C, 964 crank (stroker), custom valves & ported (XtremeCylinderHeads) etc..etc..
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Last edited by totle; 06-06-2012 at 11:28 PM..
Old 06-06-2012, 11:22 PM
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how does the ruf setup get airflow through the coolers? always wondered.
Old 06-06-2012, 11:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clutch-monkey View Post
how does the ruf setup get airflow through the coolers? always wondered.
I have wondered about the same thing. So can unfortunately not help here.
Hope some other will explain.
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Trond R.
1979 930: Garret GT35r turbo, EFI, carerra intake, Link EMS, custom GT2 cams, 98mm JE P/C, 964 crank (stroker), custom valves & ported (XtremeCylinderHeads) etc..etc..
1972 914-6 GT replica project
1986 944 Turbo
Old 06-07-2012, 04:30 AM
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Why not just get a 993tt?
Old 06-07-2012, 04:40 AM
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water to air would be the best setup for a compact area, but you'll need to mount the water cooling rad somewhere for the power you want to make though they wouldn't need to be big
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Old 06-07-2012, 05:55 AM
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How about a single air/water intercooler, put the tank in the back, the exchanger up front.

ALL the twin turbo Lamborghini's are using air/water IC's now.
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Old 06-07-2012, 08:07 AM
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I believe the ruf has two vents on the rear fenders which feed the intercoolers
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Old 06-07-2012, 10:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HelmetHead View Post
I believe the ruf has two vents on the rear fenders which feed the intercoolers
That was on the early cars, but later when he had access to wind tunnel testing he found at speed air was coming *out* of the NACA ducts on top of the fenders.

The airflow over the top of the car provides a lot of flow into the engine compartment.
(Provided it is a genuine wing or similar quality, not the cheap aftermarket louvers that flat leading edges.)
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Old 06-07-2012, 11:09 AM
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use low compression to not use intercoolers, wait, 350-400hp.....O-yeah, Ok you'll need intercoolers but 2000 lb.? My conversion to turbo added enough weight alone without intercooler and decklid spoiler to lower the rear of my77 911s so that would be dificult to reduce weight enough to get to 2000lb. That is a pretty tough request. Two turbos will add more weight.
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Old 06-07-2012, 11:25 AM
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What is shp?

350whp should be easy with a stock 3.3L block with engine management and a couple K16 turbos at 0.8bar. Stick the air/air IC under the tail and have fun. Engine should weigh around 400lb with the right gear. The rear mount headers I have for this application weigh 15 pounds. Side mount is more work/money same weight.
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:16 PM
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just water/meth inject it ,who needs an intercooler?
Chris did this in his 356 turbo
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:46 PM
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Look at Paul's 934 tribute, IC is in the rear quarter behind the wheel with a screen. Works well enough for a 934 would work perfectly with your setup.
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Old 06-07-2012, 01:25 PM
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lots of good info, thanks guys. sorry that should be HP Rarlyl8 (old aircraft mechanic). the CTI is a good start. trying to cram all this in a 73. The 993tt could be used and backdated, another way to go most of the engineering already done.
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Old 06-07-2012, 02:19 PM
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The majority of the stock CTR wing is blanked off, there is just a portion open above the air intake..... I think, and it is just a thought, that with a good seal around the bottom of the engine, and a good seal around the engne lid, the intercoolers are relying on the engine fan and pressure in the wheel wells pulling/pushing air through the intercoolers......

The only CTR with the Naca Vents is the 'original' yellow bird, and it wasn't deemed efficient enough for production cars.
I was in a modified (Ruf modified) CTR earlier this year, and had a good look around it, the only way those intercoolers are getting air across them is the engine fan pulling air through like it does with a stock car...... That and them running rich as hell
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Old 06-07-2012, 02:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James Brown View Post
the engine (unknown at this time) should make enough power to push a 70ish, 2000lb car around well. But, needs a no tail or duck tail only rear. Just thinking out loud here, nothing chipped in stone. Or, thinking on a water-cooled intercoolers? thoughts?
turbo breathing easy should beat a PMO/FI maxed out engine.
some must haves:
-twin small turbos
-twin plug
-electronic FI/engine management
-light weight
-bling (show and go, lots of polish)
-uniqueness
-good client "hefty budget"
-350-400+ shp
You should be able to get close to 400HP on a EFI 3.2 Carrera base motor running 0.5 - 0.6bar (without an intercooler), twin plugged, twin turbo's and aftermarket programmable EFI.

Lots of single turbo'd non-intercooled setups like this on this forum developing around 360HP.
Old 06-07-2012, 06:23 PM
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Did someone say twin turbo with no rear wing?

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Old 06-08-2012, 05:54 PM
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I see i am not the first to think about this!! thanks chris, perfect!
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Old 06-09-2012, 11:28 AM
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Based on a 1995 993.

Twin Garrett ball bearing turbos
Twin compact air:water intercoolers -- could do one across the back, but we also thought this layout looked really cool and it is serviceable with the tall runner 993 Carrera manifold.
Twin heat exchangers up front, with twin coolant pumps, single reservoir.

Original configured with a draw-through MAF, like a stock 993 Turbo, and lowered compression. It did about 365hp/380tq at the wheels at 0.6bar boost -- same as a stock 993T but less boost, and more torque in the lower rpms (<3500).

If you run a Ducktail spoiler, there can be a lot of room for a split core air:air intercooler. It depends on your manifold.

Call, email, or PM if you want help with the build.

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Old 06-09-2012, 02:53 PM
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