Tuscon driver mows down cyclists

[ZLP]

[RWebb]

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

Actually, I'm starting to rethink the whole bear spray plan. I'm worried someone might crash and scratch up my car. That would make me sad.

Far better would be to take advantage of our hilly terrain and blind corners. I'm thinking just patiently wait for the ass hats to let me by, wave all friendly-like, and just dart ahead a mile or two to the next steep grade with a corner at the bottom. I could "recycle" last year's Swepco by dousing down the shoulder and the first foot or two into the road. Pulling up a couple hundred yards to watch the action, they would never know who it was.

On second thought, maybe I better forget about this. Swepco is too ubiquitous to the 911. I should use Valvoline, even if I have to spend a few bucks on new stuff. Might be worth it. Hmmm... bear with me, I'm still working out the details...

If you had a sunroof you could set up a launcher for tear gas grenades

[greglepore]

Originally Posted by look 171

40 together is usually faster then a city bus. Can we look at them as a city bus and wait for a clearing to pass? This is going no where, there are good drivers and good cyclist who actually follow the law. We are just stereotyping here. I don't do much group rides these days and my racing days are over some time ago. When I did, we were doing about 30+mph on the flats. People get upset because they want to go faster then that but can't get around them. There is no wrong or right here. I have been on both sides. I know what it is like having to ride on the side of the road with broken glass that can cut a tire. some of those tires cost more then a regular car tire. Hell, you wouldn't drive your 911 on it. Tell you this, I rather drive along side or behind a group of experience riders then the few that don't know what the heck they are doing on a bike. I can predict exactly what they will do in a certain situation because there are group rules that are unknown or never apply to drivers. For example, 40 riders going around a pot hole or a park car onto another lane (#1 lane, still going the same direction)to avoid breakage of a wheel that can cause major accident. in a driver's eye, they are taking up the all the lanes. would you go around a rock on the road in your 911?

This.

Have been on both sides of this as well, stopped doing the local Wed night world championships after they started to drop people that wouldn't blow lights.

I highly doubt that the Jamis professional team was creating a roadblock, but it may very well be that enough other yahoos have that Mr Psycopath went over the edge when held up for a nano by them. Its why I despise the behavior of some groups-and in fairness, they tend to be the wannabe types, the racers get their ya-ya's out elsewhere.

[Joe Bob]

Bike lanes are not exclusively reserved for bikes......right turns and other slow vehicles are allowed to use it....
The white line on the right is just a white line......
Two vehicles CAN occupy the same lane....just not for extended periods of time....

Even joking....talking about laying down oil, doing nails or dooring people is in poor taste.

[BlueSkyJaunte]

Originally Posted by greglepore

I highly doubt that the Jamis professional team was creating a roadblock

Why is that? I highly doubt someone would spontaneously ram his car into 2 out of 20 bicyclists just for the hell of it.

Does this guy have a prior record of violent outbursts? Attacks on other cyclists? Mental health issues?

What about this mob of cyclists? Have they ever had any run-ins with motorists in the past?

[greglepore]

First sentence in Looks post. Plus, I'll buy two abreast, as pro's that ride every day have much better road discipline than the average group of rec cyclists (and I'm a rec cyclist, but I've done my share of pro level group rides in the past). So if you're moving along at 25 mph and at most taking up a half lane, you're well within the law. 3 abreast and 15, that's another matter entirely. Single file doesn't work, because a paceline is constantly rotating, ouside line moving back, inner moving up.

And its not a mob, its the Jamis/Sutter team, a highly respected group of professional riders from the US pro circuit. Not that some other "mob" (group) hadn't caused some problem in the past for which they paid the price.

I agree that a normal someone wouldn't ram a group. Someone a bit over the edge, who maybe was late for something and had a bit of an anxiety disorder just might.

What the F? Even if he had a reason its okay to discharge a lethal weapon at them because he's pissed?

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by RWebb

If you had a sunroof you could set up a launcher for tear gas grenades

Hmmm... My new (to me) Land Cruiser has a sunroof... Maybe one of those shyte spewing fertilizer sprinklers the farmers use, on a swivel mount. I wonder if that stuff burns... cow shyte napalm...

Naw, your average cyclist is so thoroughly protected from the the real world by his own bullshyte (as evidenced on this very thread) that I think it would take nuclear cow shyte to penetrate their outer crust. That, and the smell of one of those ass holes burning would drop buzzards from the sky for three counties. I need a less offensive plan.

[look 171]

If its a pro team, then the team car must have given the driver some siht for getting too close and maybe have pushed him over the edge. Pro or National riders has lot of road discipline.

[look 171]

Jeff, I agree with some of things you say over the years and find them interesting. Please calm down. We get it, you do not like bike riders. I personally do not think highly of some of them neither. Can you think of them as little kids who live in your block that play and ride their bike or skateboards in front of your house on the sidewalk? Sure they get in your way when you go and drive the Land Cruiser out of your driveway, but can you just wait until they get get pass? Don't tell me you will feel that they should not play or ride their bikes on the sidewalk, and that a bike should be ridden on the street according the law.

[jyl]

Team car was ahead waiting for the riders. Not around when Kincaide attacked.

If its a pro team, then the team car must have given the driver some siht for getting too close and maybe have pushed him over the edge. Pro or National riders has lot of road discipline.

[fintstone]

If a motorist attacked a group of slow moving cyclists, don't you think there would be serious injuries/fatalities as they usually have no protective clothing and ride in those colorful silk/Lycra ladies underwear pajama outfits.

[fintstone]

Let me get this straight...if you have 40 to 60 cyclists riding two or three abreast and at least one (maybe more) slow moving car with them taking photos or filming...and the are driving along a busy, narrow, two-lane road for hours at anywhere from 25 to 50 mph below the speed limit...and the cars on the road are the ones behaving dangerously?

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by look 171

Jeff, I agree with some of things you say over the years and find them interesting. Please calm down. We get it, you do not like bike riders. I personally do not think highly of some of them neither. Can you think of them as little kids who live in your block that play and ride their bike or skateboards in front of your house on the sidewalk? Sure they get in your way when you go and drive the Land Cruiser out of your driveway, but can you just wait until they get get pass? Don't tell me you will feel that they should not play or ride their bikes on the sidewalk, and that a bike should be ridden on the street according the law.

"Calm down"? Hmmm... maybe I should try to figure out how that green font thing works. Never have figured out how you guys do that.

To carry your little kid in the sidewalk analogy a bit further, if the rotten little bastards flipped me off and steadfastly, defiantly refused to move when I politely asked them to move out of the way, I would run 'em over like the vermin they are. Then I would make their parents wash my driveway and pick them out of my tires.

Aside from that, adult cyclists on the open road are far different than children playing in a residential neighborhood. I hope you can see the difference. There is no child-like innocence involved - these adults are well aware that they are breaking the law. They have a defiant "ffffuuuuck yoooouuuu!!!!" attitude, daring motorists to do something - anything - because whatever bad may come of it will always be the motorists' fault. They know they are pissing people off and actually relish the thought. There is no innocent "oh, I'm sorry, I forgot" that we can't ride five abreast and refuse to move over when motorists approach. Their actions are entirely intentional.

And therein lies the rub. They are intentionally screwing with motorists because they can. I have less than zero patience for anyone who would cower behind some sort of "shield", be it the assignment of fault in a motorist/cyclist incident, some sort of badge (like an abusive cop), some position of authority, or whatever. They are all cowards, hiding behind mamma's skirt, taunting and antagonizing from a position in which they know no one can touch them. I love seeing any and all such people get theirs in the end.

So, yeah, I know I can't touch them, and am resigned to just putting up with them. About the best I can muster is to downshift the 911 with its mighty twin plugged 3.0 on MFI, and give them some lovin' in the way that only MFI can - a thick brown cloud of "fffuuuk you" right back at 'em, crop dusting the whole damn peleton. Their hair will smell like gas for a week...

[ZLP]

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

"Calm down"? Hmmm... maybe I should try to figure out how that green font thing works. Never have figured out how you guys do that.

To carry your little kid in the sidewalk analogy a bit further, if the rotten little bastards flipped me off and steadfastly, defiantly refused to move when I politely asked them to move out of the way, I would run 'em over like the vermin they are. Then I would make their parents wash my driveway and pick them out of my tires.

Aside from that, adult cyclists on the open road are far different than children playing in a residential neighborhood. I hope you can see the difference. There is no child-like innocence involved - these adults are well aware that they are breaking the law. They have a defiant "ffffuuuuck yoooouuuu!!!!" attitude, daring motorists to do something - anything - because whatever bad may come of it will always be the motorists' fault. They know they are pissing people off and actually relish the thought. There is no innocent "oh, I'm sorry, I forgot" that we can't ride five abreast and refuse to move over when motorists approach. Their actions are entirely intentional.

And therein lies the rub. They are intentionally screwing with motorists because they can. I have less than zero patience for anyone who would cower behind some sort of "shield", be it the assignment of fault in a motorist/cyclist incident, some sort of badge (like an abusive cop), some position of authority, or whatever. They are all cowards, hiding behind mamma's skirt, taunting and antagonizing from a position in which they know no one can touch them. I love seeing any and all such people get theirs in the end.

So, yeah, I know I can't touch them, and am resigned to just putting up with them. About the best I can muster is to downshift the 911 with its mighty twin plugged 3.0 on MFI, and give them some lovin' in the way that only MFI can - a thick brown cloud of "fffuuuk you" right back at 'em, crop dusting the whole damn peleton. Their hair will smell like gas for a week...

Quoted so the DA can use this during your criminal trial. You seriously need to look into some kind of therapy to address your out-of-control anger.

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by ZLP

Quoted so the DA can use this during your criminal trial. You seriously need to look into some kind of therapy to address your out-of-control anger.

I find running over cyclists and small children to be quite therapeutic.

[Tobra]

You ignorant mugs need to learn about sarcasm and humor, Mr Higgins has it figured out.

Originally Posted by jyl

He didn't think anyone could identify or catch him. That's not uncommon - people in cars often think they are anonymous and untouchable - that is why there is such a thing as a drive-by _______ [insert act].

What do you base this opinion on? Seriously, this is absolute conjecture.

Oh I see you expanded on this. You have a couple anecdotal incidents that allow you to read this guy's mind and the minds of the folks you cite in your supporting statements.

Here is a flash for you. The cyclists are shading the truth. I guarantee it happened differently than how they said it did. My guess would be that a couple of the riders took offense at something the driver did or said, maybe they whacked his car, said something about his mother or something. Did the driver over react? Certainly. Are the cyclists without culpability? I don't believe that for a moment.

[ODDJOB UNO]

Originally Posted by ZLP

Quoted so the DA can use this during your criminal trial. You seriously need to look into some kind of therapy to address your out-of-control anger.

YOU ser-i-azz-lee need to get back on yer meds!

[flipper35]

Originally Posted by greglepore

First sentence in Looks post. Plus, I'll buy two abreast, as pro's that ride every day have much better road discipline than the average group of rec cyclists (and I'm a rec cyclist, but I've done my share of pro level group rides in the past). So if you're moving along at 25 mph and at most taking up a half lane, you're well within the law. 3 abreast and 15, that's another matter entirely. Single file doesn't work, because a paceline is constantly rotating, ouside line moving back, inner moving up.

And its not a mob, its the Jamis/Sutter team, a highly respected group of professional riders from the US pro circuit. Not that some other "mob" (group) hadn't caused some problem in the past for which they paid the price.

I agree that a normal someone wouldn't ram a group. Someone a bit over the edge, who maybe was late for something and had a bit of an anxiety disorder just might.

What the F? Even if he had a reason its okay to discharge a lethal weapon at them because he's pissed?

You might check your local laws on that. In WI and evidently CN you can ride two abreast within reason. To quote Paul earlier:

Riding 2 abreast – Riding 2 abreast is permitted as long as doing so does not
impede the normal and reasonable movement of traffic. Riding more than 2 abreast
is prohibited except on paths or roadways set aside for the exclusive use of bicycles.
(14-286b)

[ODDJOB UNO]

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

I find running over cyclists and small children to be quite therapeutic.

I LOVE IT!


i just LOVE MORON SPANDEX BOI's riding on a 2 lane roads posted 45mph and everyone doing 65mph!


man thats a "SPECIAL KIND OF STOOOOOO-PID!"



oh yeah i figured it out when i was around 12 yrs old that CARS and my paperboy bike was a REALLY REALLY STOOOOOO-PID COMBINATION!


ask me what its like to T-BONE a car turning right when i had light.


ask me what its like to be hit HEAD ON and GO SAILING ACROSS the HOOD/TOP of a CAR, when i had the pedestrian green light!



yeah i really miss those days....................kind of like taking a 22oz framers hammer to my PUD!


note to spandexs BOI's......................CARS/TRUCKS WILL ALWAYS WIN! ALWAYS!



i ride a bike.................i cant get far enuff away from cars.

[jyl]

Well known fact, actually. Look at the psychology literature.

"Participants drove more aggressively when they were anonymous"
The Effects of Trait Driving Anger, Anonymity, and Aggressive Stimuli on Aggressive Driving Behavior - Ellison-Potter - 2006 - Journal of Applied Social Psychology - Wiley Online Library

"drivers were more aggressive in the anonymous condition than in the identifiable condition"
Traffic Safety and Human Behavior - David Shinar - Google Books

"Aggressive behaviour is more prevalent under conditions of anonymity and driving a car provides such conditions"
The Social Psychology of Aggression: 2nd Edition - Barbara Krahé - Google Books

Etc etc - many citations.

Originally Posted by Tobra

You ignorant mugs need to learn about sarcasm and humor, Mr Higgins has it figured out.

What do you base this opinion on? Seriously, this is absolute conjecture.

Oh I see you expanded on this. You have a couple anecdotal incidents that allow you to read this guy's mind and the minds of the folks you cite in your supporting statements.

Here is a flash for you. The cyclists are shading the truth. I guarantee it happened differently than how they said it did. My guess would be that a couple of the riders took offense at something the driver did or said, maybe they whacked his car, said something about his mother or something. Did the driver over react? Certainly. Are the cyclists without culpability? I don't believe that for a moment.