Ultimate Backdating Thread

[MotoSook]

Originally posted by brawlins
I've been wondering if there are certain things you can do that are considered as NOT messing with the "purity" of a particular model - Like putting on a custom exhaust system versus changing out engine components ??

- Bill

Well, as most of us are performance minded, the majority of upgrades or changes are for better performance and handling. There are some models that no self respecting 911 owner or fan should mess with. Like putting impact bumpers on a 71S ..argh!

[Schrup]

Originally posted by Souk
Well, as most of us are performance minded, the majority of upgrades or changes are for better performance and handling. There are some models that no self respecting 911 owner or fan should mess with. Like putting impact bumpers on a 71S ..argh!

I agree, all the upgrades & backdates that I have & will do are for performance, & by the time I'm done there will probable be very little to denote my car as a Weissach other than the paint scheme. I love the color of my car. But I am deleting the Doric Grey interior for a lighter RS carpet kit & race seats. I plan to delete all the power goodies that made up part of the Weissach package to save more weight.

I think there are some special 911s that are better left original & unmolested. The condition of my car & the fact that it didn't have the original speedo was all I needed to justify pimping it to my taste. After all Weissach is little more than a dolled up SC & not in the same class as an old S or RS.

[RoninLB]

Originally posted by brawlins
I've been wondering if there are certain things you can do that are considered as NOT messing with the "purity" of a particular model -

my stock bumpers as as pure as mud

[expat]

As far as backdating a 964 (or any car mods for that) it still comes down to what you are hoping to achieve.

For me a backdated 964 gives me the looks I love with the comforts for family cruising. I will be able to have a relatively competitive fun track car for the occasional weekend racing.

The power steering rocks in the 964 for high density traffic/parking such as found in HK and I imagine LA. I dont find it at all 'disconnected' as some suggest. The C4 option would make a great deal of sense for those in cold climates and maybe for those less experienced speed warriors, as in my experience the front wheel drive pulls the front around a little which seems (IMexperience) to save the rear from switching quite so easily. I could be wrong about this but my 3.2 Carrera would swap ends much easier at the same speed/conditons as my current 3.8 964.

The 964 a\c functions as well or better than any updates to the SC or Carrera (again in my limited exp).

The 3.6 to 3.8 conversion gives you back some horses you might be losing to weight.

The aerodynamics of the underside of the 964 should give some benefit to stability and maybe more top end (would this be correct?).

Deleting some of the electrics on the 964 would be no big deal eg switch to RS3.8 tail, manually adjustable wing mirrors, manual door winders etc., if you were really concerned with weight.

I would go with the SC is I wanted a track car. Lighter and simpler.

Just some random thoughts.

Your doing a good job with this thread Souk! Very informative.

Cheers
Mark

[MotoSook]

Mark, all your points are good ones. If I didn't have a couple of other vehicles to choose from for my drive to work and to meet my buddies out for a few Quinness , I'd want a 964 based long hood too!

I have a ultimate goal for my backdate, and if I reach that goal, no passenger willl be comfortable in it..unless it's on the track

In the end, it's the individual's car...so it should be an individual decision!

But you all should know that a Mid-year backdate is the best kind of backdate

[ted]

another pic of CA's backdated 911.

3.6 power.

[Ho Hum 74]

Souk,

Your car will easily have the same hp / lbs ratio as a 964. Even at 280 hp Joe's C4 964 has the same as mine at 2400 lbs and 210 hp.

Tristan

[MotoSook]

Originally posted by Ho Hum 74
Souk,

Your car will easily have the same hp / lbs ratio as a 964. Even at 280 hp Joe's C4 964 has the same as mine at 2400 lbs and 210 hp.

Tristan

Souk likes

[Glasgow 911SC]

Curtisaa's car is a handy referencr point. I wouldn't have thought the cup style mirrors would work on an early car but his proves this theory wrong. I'm not sure flag mirrors would look so good though.

[Jeremy Wood]

OK. So I need a daily driver. Houston traffic sucks. Why not a 964 w/tiptronic, long hood etc. I'll keep my '71 w/b for autoX. I have some steel fenders w/9" flares already bonded on (the '71 is getting f'glass fenders). My question is -- has anyone mounted 'custom' offset 17" fuchs on a 964 chassis. With 9" front flares it wouldn't seem to be a problem. I'll use the 9" ST flares on the rear same question -- how wide and what offset would work. I have ST flares on my '71 and they will easily take 15 x 10" wheels. I'm looking for a 964 tiptronic. Anyone know of a good one for sale? Boy this backdating idea has really got some potential for those of us who love that long hood look!!!

[MotoSook]

A 964 w/ tip should not be hard to find..and the prices for them are very favorable these days.

I wonder if on a 964 backdate, if it wouldn't be easier to do the front fender ("wing" speak English you nuts!) treatment that the article in 911 World described. That is, use the stock fenders and weld on the leading edges of an early fender.

Jeremy's ST front flares are going to be welded on anyway, so welding on the leading edge of the early fenders wouldn't be difficult. Add a hood (f-glass) and a RSR front fender, and BAM! you have long hood. The rear treatment would be about the same.

Removing the fenders is probably more of a PITA than welding on the leading edges of the fenders and the flares, me thinks!

While looking for early fenders, I found some that had badly corroded rocker areas and flare area. The turnsignal area is likely to corrode too, but if one is looking for just a good turnsignal area, the chances are likely better than findign a whole good fender. Get the idea?

[Schrup]

I have researched this & can't find a solid answer. Can I use my regulators from my power windows to backdate to manual. I want to order some RS door panels, but won't if I have to spend $240 on regulators.

[RoninLB]

Originally posted by Schrup
I have researched this & can't find a solid answer.

But, But,
You never asked me.......

[KTL]

edit........... aw crap! Ron beat me to it!

Paul,

I think what you need to do is get the manual regulators from a 1978-89 car. If your car is a coupe, the replacement regulators must be from a COUPE. Call up a dismantler or post a WTB ad for them specifying they must be 1978 or newer COUPE regulators (manual).

I say 78 or newer because the PET says 74-77 regulators are a different part # than the 78-up ones. I tend to trust PET more than the tech reference that Ron posted- even though the part numbers sorta agree. No offense Ron!

#'s for 74-77, per PET, are different than what Ron's post shows, but agree with the #'s from 78-up. So i'd ask for 78-up regulators since your car is a 1980.
Part numbers are:

Left = 911.542.929.03
Right = 911.542.930.03

[RoninLB]

Hi Kevin..
the older numbers may be the 2 point regulators.. and he should have the 3 bolt units to install.. I don't know which year they went to that.. so there's a chance he may have to drill another hole for the 3 point units.. the 3rd hole position has been
up-grated a couple of times.. no big deal

[MotoSook]

Just thought I'd awaken this thread.

I just spent the last 3 hours in the garage working on the backdate..well, there was JUST a few minutes of down time to drink a few beers and gab on the phone with a co-conspirator. Just few few OK!

It's getting warmer outside, here in the Midwest, and I have about 6 weeks to have the car ready for a Test and Tune Day. (body work, paint, suspension, new exhaust, rebuild rear calipers, new seals..argh!!!)

Got brand spanking new Sport shocks from "BlkBird," a fellow Pelican! Thanks!

I had to remove the oil cooling system to get one last bolt out to get the passenger fender out. I needed to remove it for the paint and body work anyway, but others may not have too. Mine just happen to be in the wrong place.

It was too late to get the grinder out to get that spot weld off to get the fender free (the kid's rooms are right above the garage!..have to fix that! Kid will be moving to the shed ).

SO! No pictures tonight. Tomorrow I'll test fit the front sheet metal and bumper. Then I'll have some pictures!

[MotoSook]

So what's a post w/o pictures? Nuth'n!

[MotoSook]

Test fitting of fenders...and last view of short hood!



I had to trim the fender a bit to clear the bumper shock bracket...a little buzz with the zipsaw and the die grinder and it fits just perfectly!



SO...........!!!!.....thadah!!!!!!!!!!! I'm coming to get you RGruppe! You wont even see me coming...WUF! WUF!





I've got a little more fitting to get it as right as my anal self can get it, but that'll take another set of hands to just get it to move that extra 1mm. Then the S-bumper gets drilled for mounting and such. Then the flares get welded on..maybe this weekend and the soda blasting after!

[RoninLB]

I used body shop 3M dum dum between the fender and tub to replace factory dum dum

[MotoSook]

Good tip Ron....where can I get it? I'll need new fender mounting hardware (just because!!) so I was going to order the clay along with the speed screws and clips...from who ever has the two, but that factory clay looks heavy ( ..how's that Eric?!)

I got the S-bumper from a buddy, and I don't know who made it..the thing fits so perfectly, I'm thinking about buying a spare in case I have an agricultural excursion at the track!

Anyone had good experiences with an S-bumper that bought it from an MFG or know the MFG of the part?