Ultimate Motor Oil Thread or Why we hate CJ4/SM oils

[tchanson]

Originally Posted by Wavey

Whoa! If my head math is right, 10 quarts on Mobil 1 V-Twin = $100, 10 quarts of other quality oils = $50 max, mean of 8-18 range = 13 HP, therfore less than $4.00/HP? Compare that to other mods. Great protection + extremely cheap HP, even over many oil changes.

That's what caught my eye several weeks ago in this thread as well.

When its other attributes are factored in with Charles' own dyno testing, the extra 4 or 5 bucks a quart for the Mobil 1 V-Twin 20w50 (or the RP and Amsoil equivalents) seemed like a fair deal for my cars.



Tim

[cnavarro]

Brad Penn comes out to $5.25-6.50/qt shipped tax free, depending how far it has to go. This is right in line with what regular M1 goes for around me, if not cheaper, than compared to what Napa charges for M1. Swepco is more like $6.75-8/qt shipped.

All the other oils that I like (Amsoil Harley, M1 V-Twin, RP Max-Cycle) can be special ordered around me locally, but come out to more like $9-10+/qt, plus tax. We'll see how the NSL VR-1 comes out, but even though I can get that locally, it's still over $50/case for the non-synthetic and even more for the syn version, plus tax. Nothing can be picked up "off-the-shelf", at least here.

I side for saving the money and changing the oil more often, since I don't drive the 911 as much as I wish I had time to. I change it every six months, regardless. It would seem the many shops who use Brad Penn and Swepco over the more expensive synthetics have their reasons too, especially considering the use of these oils in their customer's and even their own race engines.

[cnavarro]

Originally Posted by EPorsche

Charles,
Are those oils listed for air cooled or water cooled? Just curious because I don't think many of us with older (mid year, SC, Carrera) would use such a then oil.

All those factory approved oils I listed would be choices, say for a water-cooled, new Porsche, but for those using M1 0w40 even in their older cars, they should be adequate choices even for an aircooled Porsche, at least according to Porsche based off their blanket-recommendations for oils.

[movin]

Sure is a PITA these days trying to find a good oil for the old P-Car. It wasn't long ago you go just about anywhere and find a decent oil, it fact there was always the arguments about which oil was best among at least a dozen. Now we're virtually relegated to few that are available thru mail order for what we need. Seems the main players in the lubrication business just blew us off as irrelevant to their business. I just can't order motor oil like my wife orders from Avon, it's stupid. That's why until I can pickup Brad Penn or Amsoil thru a local distributor, forget it. So that leaves me with Motorcycle oils?

[Wavey]

I agree, movin. I just ordered two 6-quart cases of Mobil 1 V-Twin yesterday ($113 shipped). Sure would be nice if they'd make it available in 5-quart jugs like the rest of their products, at a lower per-quart cost, and make it available anywhere.

[dmwallace]

Movin,

I don't know where you're located but for most metro areas there should be some alternatives that should work with a little bit of pre-planning. When I decided to try Brad Penn in my '89 3.2 I used the contact form on their web site, got a email response the same day with a name/number of the local distributor which was ~20 miles away and I picked up a case the next day. Swepco's contact email was not answered but when I called their 800 number they said their rep for the area would call me back by end of day and he did. He offered to take an order over the phone and indicated that I could get UPS ground delivery within a week. Note also that our host carries Swepco and Mr. Navarro carries both Brad Penn and Swepco if you are not located in a metro area that would have local distributors.

Good luck with your search.

Regards,
David

[movin]

I'm in North Los Angeles and already tried the local speed shops, including Hawaii Racing and PWS. They know about Brad Penn but have no desire to stock it. Performance Products does have Swepco but not in 20W-50. WalMart does carry Mobil1 20w-50 cycle oil, but I may as well get RedLine from the speed shops at that price. Some folks on BITOG swear by Valvoline Maxlife saying it was worth a look because Valvoline does state it has 20% PAO. I know Charles said the zinc and phosphorous was a bit low but maybe it would work out. Can't find much on the specs though, HT/HS ?? who knows.

[cnavarro]

If you don't want to pay shipping for Brad Penn and have ready access to 15w40 Swepco, what's the big deal. I wouldn't even being to mess with Maxlife...

[DaveE]

For once it looks like living in the east is a plus. I found a distributor who sold me Brad Penn for $30 a case.....................

[movin]

Charles, like a few Carrera owners my P-car burns a little oil, especially at start. I tried HDEO's and found 40W a bit too smokey, especially Rotella 5W-40. The
50W oils are a little less embarassing. I tried Castrol HM 20W-50 and it was great for reduced smoke but I found out otherwise it doesn't do my engine much good based on the info. I read here.

[Johnb911]

Man I'm sorry but is the Royal Puple oil Synthetic or not.
Which of the two do I use in my 79sc?
I have easy access to it here in town and this thread has made my head spin.

It's just like talking to tweeky audio guys. At least there I know what they are talking about.

HELP ME.

The car goes away for the winter next week.

Thanks!!!!

[Wavey]

Originally Posted by movin

Charles, like a few Carrera owners my P-car burns a little oil, especially at start. I tried HDEO's and found 40W a bit too smokey, especially Rotella 5W-40. The
50W oils are a little less embarassing. I tried Castrol HM 20W-50 and it was great for reduced smoke but I found out otherwise it doesn't do my engine much good based on the info. I read here.

Movin, I've always had some startup smoke with my '88 (84K miles, excellent maintenance). Mostly controlable by idling before shutdown. A few months ago I had just changed my oil, using the new formula Mobil 1 15-50. But then that EOS thread started, which got me reading Charles' oil report, where I learned that the new formula M1 sucked. So I added a pint of EOS to hold me over to the next oil change.

The point of all that is, after about 100 miles I started getting a LOT less startup smoke, to the point that it's almost gone. The difference is quite dramatic. The shut-down procedure had eliminated most of it, but now there is almost never any smoking at startup. Also quite a bit less valve train noise. I asked Charles about this effect but he wasn't sure what was going on.

I'm switching to M1 V-Twin at the next change so I'll see how that does, smoke-wise. But you might try a bottle of EOS, assuming you can find some. Not sure if it works as a one-time treatment, or if you'd need to use it every change. If you can't find any, PM me and I'll send you a bottle; got a few left that I may or may not need.

[GothingNC]

Originally Posted by movin

Sure is a PITA these days trying to find a good oil for the old P-Car. It wasn't long ago you go just about anywhere and find a decent oil, it fact there was always the arguments about which oil was best among at least a dozen. Now we're virtually relegated to few that are available thru mail order for what we need. Seems the main players in the lubrication business just blew us off as irrelevant to their business. I just can't order motor oil like my wife orders from Avon, it's stupid. That's why until I can pickup Brad Penn or Amsoil thru a local distributor, forget it. So that leaves me with Motorcycle oils?

Not a hassle to order for me.
I ordered my BP Oil from Charles N online and received the oil two days later.

My brother ordered two cases of BP from a local distributor on Monday morning and received it on Tuesday afternoon.

[dmwallace]

Wavey,

I also noticed less start-up smoke, quieter idle valvetrain noise and freer revving after putting Brad Penn in my '89.

Regards,
David

[Patrice911]

Originally Posted by GothingNC

Not a hassle to order for me.
I ordered my BP Oil from Charles N online and received the oil two days later.

My brother ordered two cases of BP from a local distributor on Monday morning and received it on Tuesday afternoon.

Who's the local distributor in Raleigh?

[dmwallace]

I posted this earlier but here it is again:

To find a local distributor for Brad Penn click the contact form on their web site; you will get a reply same or next day. http://www.bradpennracing.com/contact.asp. To find a local rep for Swepco call their order center line at 1.800.433.5735 to ask. Or you can order through our host or Mr. Navarro...

Regards,
David.

No affiliation with either company, etc.

[mgata]

Hello everybody!
I am new to the forum, but since I am the new owner of a 1984 911 I have been reading the oil forum about three times per day for the past week. I know all the choices for the oils and since I am not sure what the car has in it right now, I am ready for an oil change. The car is in excellent shape, in and out, including the engine. Small gremlins, but nothing that can't be fixed ( not by me, but by the mechanic after I do some OT at work).
I contacted the Brad Penn people ( wasn't easy) and I found the the closest place that sells (sometimes) the 20/50 BP is about 50 miles away. I reside in the Central Florida area. I am torn between BP and the Mobil 1 V twin oil. Mobil 1, is right down the road ( one mile away) at Wall Mart for about 8,50/quart. My only worry with the Mobil 1 is, possible leakage after I put it in. Mobil 1 is all I use in my daily driver ( fully syn) and my wife's car, but I know from you guys that the only Mobil 1 I should put in the Porsche is the V twin. The car will be driven once, sometimes twice per week, 17 miles each way on the highway. I am not a big fan of frequent oil changes...in my regular, water cooled cars I keep the Mobil 1 syn oil for about 8-10,000 miles with no problems at all. Can Brad Penn go for 5-6000 miles/year with just a filter change in between, or should I just go with the Mobil 1 V twin? I do like those extra HP claims...but I am afraid of leaks...right now I have none. Did any of you experience any leaks with the V twin?
Any opinions are appreciated.

[JFairman]

I think you should try it yourself...
Find your own opinion and experience with it.

There is so much hearsay and biased opinions on the subject.. anotherwords I don't think synthetic leaks out faster. They never have for me anyway.
You hear the complainers more than the people that have had good results, and the v twin stuff is a recent recommendation so not enough experiences with it are out there yet.

I wouldn't leave dino oil like the Brad Penn in longer than 3000-3500 miles myself.
Back when it was Kendall GT-1 20w 50 in the 80's I changed it around 3000 miles.

[Steve@Rennsport]

Originally Posted by JFairman

I wouldn't leave dino oil like the Brad Penn in longer than 3000-3500 miles myself.
Back when it was Kendall GT-1 20w 50 in the 80's I changed it around 3000 miles.

Thats VERY good advice and valid for ANY type oil you use,...

Oil is cheaper than engines.

[Jeff Alton]

Oil is cheap is the wisest advice that could be given. Same goes for fliters. Even if the oil does not break down before you change it, it is still moving contaminents around the system. I never understood why one would want to leave those in the system for extended periods of time.....

Cheers