I make Parallel Flow Micro-Channel Condensers for 911's front and rear

[KelogGes]

Sorry, I am not yet sure how to get the line width wrap shorter in my posts?

[scottb]

Interesting innovations. Subscribing.

[Dr J]

Good job. Definitely expect better performance than the tube and fin design. The rear condenser should be great. However, there may be problems with the front, since I think this design may require the condenser to be mounted perpendicular or at least at an angle to pick up the liquid refrigerant at the bottom.

[DRACO A5OG]

Originally Posted by Cloggie

I do not mean to rain on your parade, but I notice the side gaps on your condensor.

I was going to open up some holes to optimize my tail's designed for Turbos but was told by a well respected Pelican and engineer that the air would take the LEAST PATH OF RESISTANCE therefore the rear condensor would not get as much air as needed.

This makes sense, maybe a dam to divert, force air over the condensor?

Jim

[KelogGes]

for this condenser to work properly the fan must pull or push FRESH AIR THROUGH the evaporator NOT ARROUND IT.

I suggest you completely seal the condenser so that all incoming air that comes into the engine compartment comes sealed to come first THROUGH the condenser tubes before it goes into the engine compartment.

on the one i tried similar to yours I used a piece of flat thin clear plastic to take up the side gaps then added some thin foam rubber as needed and got a good seal of the condenser to the trunk lid

OR you can buy some additional electric fans mounted directly to the condenser in a few places

[KelogGes]

opps typo I meant
for this condenser to work properly the fan must pull or push FRESH AIR THROUGH the Condenser NOT ARROUND IT.

[DRACO A5OG]

Agreed. mine is OEM carrera lid and condensor with Turbo tail. I think I am going to fab a dam with some corrogated plasitic for light weight effects, see how she cools.

[scottb]

Slightly off-topic, but related.

Does anyone know the CFM rating of the front condenser fan?

Thanks!

[Danny_Ocean]

Originally Posted by KelogGes

Sorry, I am not yet sure how to get the line width wrap shorter in my posts?

Your mile-wide pics are stretching the lines off the "edge" of the page.

[Cloggie]

Thanks for the feedback, and yes, the Retroaire condenser is not an ideal fit and one closer to the shape of the engine lid opening would be nice. Having said that, clearances are tight between the lid and the engine components so I suspect that the refrigerant fittings need to be positioned correctly so that you can get them on, which needs some side clearance unless the fittings go "down" into the engine compartment which in turn would need to be in the right spot.

As for air flow, I thought about it and decided that the priority for me is engine cooling and if the condenser is a little less happy as it does not get maximum air flow then so be it. If it gets to be a problem I will likely fit something to redirect the flow. I know that the air will go to the path of least resistance, but considering the path it needs to follow to "go around" the condenser I suspect that a reasonable amount of airflow will still get through the condenser. We shall see. Retroaire has not reported any issues with this setup and they have put a few in, so it may not be as big an issue as one would think....one thing that goes through my mind is that air cooling is not totally dependent on the maximum possible air speed, there being some non-linear effects I read about a while back...slower moving air can apparently take more heat away than faster moving air, or at least it is non-linear.

In the interests of protecting the engine, I did a few other things like add a cooling fan to the front oil cooler and install a J&S Safeguard. This stuff is still underway so can't report out.

I am still waiting for my vacuum pump and refrigerant (r134a) plus I need to adjust one hose to fit the way I like before I charge the system.

D.

[brads911sc]

Great Idea!! Id pilot/test for you in the high humidity / houston heat... Keep up the great work.

[khamul02]

Is this one designed to fit inside a tail:

[KelogGes]

hamul02 NO;

it goes inside the engine deck lid and perfectly fits the air intake opening contours

The picture shows the condenser sitting on top of the outside of the deck lid NOT Where it goes inside

Purpose for taking this picture was to show how perfectly its curved on one angle, related to the deck lid outer side

[KelogGes]

the right and left vertical tubes are slightly wider then the lid air opening on the outside of the lid and you can see this by noticing the right side is lower because its sitting in the air opening recess on the outside; and the left side is outside air opening recess;

when you look at the other picture that shows the condenser inside where it goes it fits perfectly and the condenser tube outside small brackets can be used to attach it with screws and it can be completly sealed easily to the air intake inside deck lid hole

[KelogGes]

This picture shows a cross section of the latest state of the art type of Micro-Channel aluminium Extrusion technology I use in my condensers

[Porchcar guy]

Subscribed with pleasure....Condensers look really good ! I need a A/C fix in Albuquerque :=)

[KelogGes]

For several weeks I had been working on an evaporator that would fit into the smugglers box OEM plastic blower unit with a little modification to the top of the plastic box, but its taking up too much of my time and taking me away from the condensers, so I am going to shelve it for later and go back to getting the rear contoured condensers prototype finished, installed, and tested

On a different note: I was contacted by owners of Rennair last Friday here after reading what I am doing here and who might be interested in my condensers, they did not know that for the last couple of weeks I had meant to contact them but I was too busy, I want to try using one of their serpentine evaporators they have that is a direct fit replacement for the OEM Porsche evaporator with slightly better technology over the tube and fin. We are making a trade to try out each other’s products, they are really nice and they are sending me one of their evaporators and a thermal expansion valve. I will follow by sending them one of my new rear condensers after I test it.

[Barrpete]

Originally Posted by KelogGes

for this condenser to work properly the fan must pull or push FRESH AIR THROUGH the evaporator NOT ARROUND IT.

I suggest you completely seal the condenser so that all incoming air that comes into the engine compartment comes sealed to come first THROUGH the condenser tubes before it goes into the engine compartment.

on the one i tried similar to yours I used a piece of flat thin clear plastic to take up the side gaps then added some thin foam rubber as needed and got a good seal of the condenser to the trunk lid

OR you can buy some additional electric fans mounted directly to the condenser in a few places

I'd be a bit leery that by restricting air flow through the condensor only that it might also effectively reduce engine cooling air flow and increase the engine temp. Particularly at idle. Or maybe that effect is reduced by adding additional electric fans?

[Mitch Leland]

Originally Posted by Barrpete

I'd be a bit leery that by restricting air flow through the condensor only that it might also effectively reduce engine cooling air flow and increase the engine temp. Particularly at idle. Or maybe that effect is reduced by adding additional electric fans?

+1 for Barrpete...

I'm also concerned as the efficiency of the condenser goes up the heat load (dumping) on the engine goes up as well.

A second point to consider for the front condenser, the Parallel Flow Micro-Channel Condenser doesn't want to lay flat, it needs to stand up right to work at it's most efficient level. From what I've read the after market "serpentine" condenser will still out perform the PFMC unit unless you want to butcher the front sheet metal to allow vertical installation.

[kuehl]

Originally Posted by Mitch Leland

+1 for Barrpete...

I'm also concerned as the efficiency of the condenser goes up the heat load (dumping) on the engine goes up as well.

A second point to consider for the front condenser, the Parallel Flow Micro-Channel Condenser doesn't want to lay flat, it needs to stand up right to work at it's most efficient level. From what I've read the after market "serpentine" condenser will still out perform the PFMC unit unless you want to butcher the front sheet metal to allow vertical installation.