What happened to the Mulholland "King of the Hill" RSR?

[nameisbauer]

That was awesome.

[Jeff Hail]

Originally Posted by TooTall

Hey Dave,

Unfortunately, I don't have any photos from Willow. My camera was stolen that weekend. The camera wasn't worth much but the film was sure priceless!

However, I recently stumbled across this.......



Cheers,
Kurt O.

Dave,Kurt,
Harald K got all fired up when he saw your photo. Yes the 914 next to the 917 was his before it went on steroids. Harald says thanks and added a little piece of history to that era.

"Thanks ever so much. That is the Monster under construction sitting next to Otis Chandler's 917. I was to beat Otis in that with my monster at Ontario Motor Speedway two years later in a time trial. Johnny Thomas, who nannied that car and Otis' 930, was much faster in them. I'm attaching a picture of the three cars at the annual Porsche Parade in San Diego".


Thanks again,
Harald

[lfot]

Some Bob's pics from tonight.

Jim's car is lookin' sweeeeeet.


Nobel M400


Cuda!


The Time Machine that Cocaine Built.


Cool Rod.


Very cool Hot Rod


The Caddy from Hell




Radu's Beast for the evening.


Look at what showed up at the end of the night.

[CRE]

Originally Posted by LateBrakeU2

Jeff,
I think there are a couple of fundamental differences between our car culture and the current crop of teens.IMO the fast and furious films have greatly influenced young drivers over the last ten years or so,and the mishaps have increased proportionatley.The emphasis now is all about your whip and image,all we wanted to do was learn how to drive.It wasn't about the car, it was about the aesthetic of DRIVING-that's why certain guys on the hill could hustle sheetboxes faster than others in superior equipment.Of course that was a by product of the Mulholland dynamic-an impossibility in todays "street racer"enviroment.Think about it,Charlie was an urban legend in his grand sports clone,but he would have been just backround had he not driven the wheels off it. Todays cars,while infinitely safer,are much,much faster and that's where the problem comes in.There seems to be money for turbo upgrades and gook tubes but not for DE events. Most of the core guys I hung with from back then took their fledgling talent very seriously.We had a bigger idea of where we wanted to take it.The emphasis was on smoothness,car control,throttle input..all traits necessary for surviving such an unforgiving enviroment- and we rarely put a wheel wrong on track as a result!(Like CRE mentioned it made for one hell of a crop of SS endurance racers).Some of us categorically wanted nothing else but to become race cars drivers-my hero was Ronnie Peterson and I patterned my style after him up there. Vin Diesel images aside,I don't think a large amount of todays car youth really aspire beyond the moment.That certainly may have been true for some on Mul in the 70's or as Dave Barry wrote in his article"lingering between high school and the start of a career" or something along that line. Today it's seemingly angst without direction, limits or talent and while that's nothing new cars now as you alluded to are much easier to drive and deceptively confidence inspiring,providing for bigger drama..

Mark has nailed it. We ran cars we could barely afford. Some old, some new and on the payment plan. I had a couple of Datsun 510's one which cost me $300.00 that I drove for 3 years and sold it for $300.00. Guys had Capri's, VW's with reversed rear rims, Pontiac Tempests, station wagons, Camaro's, mom's cars, etc. you name it. The car wasn't the deal but the manner in which it was driven. Heck, Van Tress came up with a different car virtually every night.

Once, Bullwinkle chased a dude in some forgotten high dollar sports car across the hill in a 'restored' gold 64 cad convertible with tan seats and 4 of us in it laughing our butts off. The guy in the 'sports car' kept looking wide eyed in the rear view mirrors and were no match for 6,000 lbs of steel in the hands of a good driver. He probably retired to become Hollywood Blvd. cruisers to never return to Mulholland again.

Now one can purchase an EVO with enough gadgets to produce 500hp and 12 inch wide sticky tires with traction control and abs. But, you know they sure tend to CRASH a heck of a lot and at high speeds. My nephew has been 170mph plus on his corvette on LA Freeways late at night. But, as a drag racer hasn't a clue as to how to drive a road course or a twisty 2 lane road. To me it is a shame that people buy these super High Performance cars and then think they can drive like Schumacher.

I've noticed that most young drivers tend to learn their skills from Video games! And they've absolutely no clue as to what can and DOES happen in the real world once a car gets away from them.

[lfot]

Originally Posted by CRE

To me it is a shame that people buy these super High Performance cars and then think they can drive like Schumacher.

I would be interested to see how many of them actually know who Schumacher is. Most kids and ricers, and really anyone with a high performance car, thinks speed is all about drag racing on the streets. Lame. That's just a car contest with all-in-all very little to do with the driver other than quick shifts. (Given, I'm not talking about professional nitro dragsters. Whole different ball game.) Yes, there are the few that get into canyon driving, track days, drifting... but most stick with stop light to stop light or highway speed contests.

[CRE]

Originally Posted by KevinP73

No doubt Joe was a charactor. I made the mistake one day of asking him where something was located........ never made that mistake again.

Ah, JOE FACTORS! Awesome place. Back in the 70's a few of us from CRE thought about printing up maps of where everything was located in Factors!

Figured we could sell them at the door and make a few bucks! Never happened, but it was an idea. LOL.

Sure miss the place & Joe sitting in his chair, arms crossed talking, talking, talking. Grade 8 by the pound! Yeah. Saturday's you could run into anyu number of racers and street hot rodders, boat guys, land speed record guys, even low riders looking for hydraulic fittings. Just never knew who you would find in there prowling the isles.

[SSB]

Originally Posted by CRE

Mark has nailed it. m.

Leonard has a Vette ??? Geez I'm getting old.

Sometime back I was in Miami driving south on hwy 95 following Lance in his girlfriends Caravan (prior to current wife). These two cars come whipping through traffic swerving from one side to the other. One car tried to cut between Lance and myself. I closed the gap to prevent him from coming in but he squeaked in there.
Now you know me, I don't flinch. But man I wanted to "Pit" this guy into the wall. .....but it 's not my car.................Grrrrrrrrrrrrrr!

Now I will admit chasing a certain 240Z up the 405 from the 101 to the 118 in a DEMO Chevy Citation X11 all the way to Balboa Blvd. Hmmmmmmmmmm, same? Fast forward and I see this video game where that is exactly the driving they do. But there is a major differance. Failure was not an option for us.

[CRE]

Originally Posted by SSB

Officer Svender Bender

OHMYGOD! ARE YOU KIDDING ME? THEY LET HIM DRIVE?

lol ASK HIM ABOUT HIS FIESTA AND A CERTAIN FIRE HYDRANT THAT GOT LOOSE FROM THE CURB.

[SSB]

Originally Posted by CRE

OHMYGOD! ARE YOU KIDDING ME? THEY LET HIM DRIVE?

lol ASK HIM ABOUT HIS FIESTA AND A CERTAIN FIRE HYDRANT THAT GOT LOOSE FROM THE CURB.

........and the time he drove Deucer and me back from Sears after Deucer wiped off the right side of the Peugeot (again) while we sat in the back seat and got drunk and sang (really) songs from the 50's (the only songs he knows)

By the way, he says he's the fastest driver at the "Test Track" I think that's a really good thing, don't you?

.or the time he chauffeured MM back from a race.....!

[CRE]

Originally Posted by SSB

........and the time he drove Deucer and me back from Sears after Deucer wiped off the right side of the Peugeot (again) while we sat in the back seat and got drunk and sang (really) songs from the 50's (the only songs he knows)

By the way, he says he's the fastest driver at the "Test Track" I think that's a really good thing, don't you?

.or the time he chauffeured MM back from a race.....!

Svenbolley would probably still give us a ticket today.

Stopped at the gas station on the way to work a couple of weeks ago. Heard a V-12 Ferrari coming up to song, turned around and said to myself, "well, you don't see that every day of the week." It was a GTO leaving the stop sign and heading down Hwy 121 in Sonoma. Then another rounded the corner and ran through the gears, then another, then another. OH MY GOSH 9 in all! Followed to smell of happily burned Hydrocarbons to Sears Point Raceway were no fewer than 12 were assembled for some 45th anniversery Tour.

Yeah, it was a good day.

[Jeff Hail]

Originally Posted by CRE

Mark has nailed it. We ran cars we could barely afford. Some old, some new and on the payment plan. I had a couple of Datsun 510's one which cost me $300.00 that I drove for 3 years and sold it for $300.00. Guys had Capri's, VW's with reversed rear rims, Pontiac Tempests, station wagons, Camaro's, mom's cars, etc. you name it. The car wasn't the deal but the manner in which it was driven. Heck, Van Tress came up with a different car virtually every night.

Once, Bullwinkle chased a dude in some forgotten high dollar sports car across the hill in a 'restored' gold 64 cad convertible with tan seats and 4 of us in it laughing our butts off. The guy in the 'sports car' kept looking wide eyed in the rear view mirrors and were no match for 6,000 lbs of steel in the hands of a good driver. He probably retired to become Hollywood Blvd. cruisers to never return to Mulholland again.

Now one can purchase an EVO with enough gadgets to produce 500hp and 12 inch wide sticky tires with traction control and abs. But, you know they sure tend to CRASH a heck of a lot and at high speeds. My nephew has been 170mph plus on his corvette on LA Freeways late at night. But, as a drag racer hasn't a clue as to how to drive a road course or a twisty 2 lane road. To me it is a shame that people buy these super High Performance cars and then think they can drive like Schumacher.

I've noticed that most young drivers tend to learn their skills from Video games! And they've absolutely no clue as to what can and DOES happen in the real world once a car gets away from them.

Agree 110%! Everything I ran I built. I couldn't afford anything high dollar as a lad. In fact grey primer was in vogue at the time (with a laugh). Back when the selection of off the shelf parts was not as plentiful or didn't exist as does today. Most of us had to resort to experimentation and ingenuity. Sometimes that meant breaking stuff. Oh well it was part of the game. The most important part needed of course was a talented driver. I had to learn the dynamics of driving by what I had and sometimes it wasn't much. Seat time is like school. The more you feel and take in the more you learn.....you know the rest!

Without a good driver a car is just a box with four wheels. Reminds me of my Barracuda which originally had drum brakes all the way around when I first got it. It might as well of had no brakes at all. Until I put disc brakes on it was a huge learning experience for car control. It forced me to learn momentum, weight transfer and drift. I think I learned the most from older, heavier and lessor performing cars than anything modern.

New technology is great. If it creates a false sense of security, diminishes feedback and includes a cupholder then I will pass. I will take the ABS and the SRS though. Those two do work.

I am on the insurance side of the car game now. You would not believe the amount of claims involving EVO's and WRX's. I am not talking scrapes here. These cars are involved in some serious wrecks. Average repair cost is $7k for a minor accident. Most of what I see is front corner impacts which is most of the time a judgement/ speed indicator. Most of the drivers are very young and clearly do not have the experience behind the wheel of any car let alone these little rods. Throw in the multi thousand dollar stereo and cell phone to distract driver attention and it's a shunt waiting to happen.

[SSB]

Originally Posted by CRE

Yeah, it was a good day.

no wonder you don't see 240Z's anymore

[LateBrakeU2]

[[QUOTE=SSB;3567377
.or the time he chauffeured MM back from a race.....![/QUOTE]

Actually that was en route to Firebird..and the fun didn't end on the 1-10 remember Ron?
Drove Lance's Integra in the national and got walked by a horde of 505's- If that wasn't enough Ruhlman dives under me into the right before the tower turn waay too hot,stuffs it into the tire wall at a 45 angle then like shot from a wrist rocket airborne backwards across track and plants it squarely in the drivers window on descent.Still have that helmet with corvette red paint signature!

BTW that GT3 RS at Bob's is Tommy D's new toy- Will be up for the 4hr next weekend..see if you can put the touch on Tom for some SIM time for us!!

[TomPabst]

Hi Guys..........

Regarding: Riverside International Raceway..........simulated

It's been a while since I've posted here but not because I haven't been busy at work on the simulation (realistic) of RIR. I am some 276 hours into the project as of today (expected to be around 350 hours.....estimate).

I'm getting close (about 20 hours) to having a "beta" version of the track that Ron Cortez (and a couple other drivers here at Infineon Raceway) are going to test drive for me to fine tune the track surface configuration and elevations (as well as camber and turn radius, etc.). When that track is ready, I'll post some screenshots here.

Right now, I'm working on the layout of the main straight, pits (buildings, fencing, walls) and main grandstand side (including the tunnel under Turn #1). There are so few photos to help me and the video of the 1988 (last) NASCAR race (on YouTube.....if you haven't checked it out already) doesn't help me much in this area of thet rack (camera keeps zooming in too close to the cars to see any of the trackside areas).

Here's a "wish list" of photos I wish I had. Do you guys have any of these?

1. Main grandstand (full length...particularly that side of the track related to buildings on either side of the main grandstand).

2. Pit out/exit area......mostly need detail on the fencing and armco/walls layouts and positions.

3. Main pit area buildings (I have the two main garages...that was easy...it's the small buildings, snack stand, fuel pumps......don't know where they are located without better photos).

4. A close-up photo of the "Winners Circle" or whatever that white blob is in all the videos but I can't make out (except for the words on it).

For those of you who may have missed my original post to this Forum (thanks to Ron Cortez alerted me to its existence)....I think it's back on page 95 or so......... I am building a full realistic simulation of the RIR track in all it's configurations. The current version is the full sports car or GP track, ala the late 1980's style. I will also build (when this one is done) the NASCAR (80's), and the SCCA short course (80's) as well as the the GP course depicting the early to mid 1970's era. All of those will take much less time once this initial track and layout are done....as I can build the others from this one by simply "cutting and pasting" the layout and trackside objects (adding new ones for the other eras).

Anyway....that's the plan.

When this current version is done I'm going to a host a gathering at our shop at Infineon Raceway for anyone and everyone who helped on this project or has an interest in driving the old Riverside in a simulator. Scott Pruett (last IROC race winner at RIR) has agreed to come to this event, so that should make it fun just by itself!

Oh, one last thing.......if any of you have or know of anyone who was an SCCA turn worker at Riverside (any era)......if you send me a picture of you in your white SCCA worker uniform (close up but full body shot).....I'll put you in the simulation! Make sure to tell me what turn station you worked at as that's where I'll put you (and yes, you will be visible and recognizable from the cockpit of the simulated race car).

Dig, dig, dig.......for those pics guys! I'm desparate for the ones I listed above.

Regards,

Tom Pabst
Pabst-Racing.com
Infineon Raceway, Sonoma CA

PS: I'm just a few feet from Ron Cortez's shop here at Infineon.....if you email pics to Ron 'cause you've done it before, he'll get them to me!

[SSB]

Originally Posted by TomPabst

I'm desparate

Tom Pabst
Pabst-Racing.com
Infineon Raceway, Sonoma CA

You got this one, right?




This photo is a rollerskate race where there were two drunks at the tailend of the line who never made it past turn 6

[TomPabst]

SSB,

Thanks for the photos. I do have the first one (do you guys know Ron Cortez is one of those cars ....I think the 4th car....starting that race?).

The second one I didn't have.....damn! I forgot to search the roller skating websites for pictures of Riverside! LOL..... But actually, I have many pictures like it......but this one does show me a better idea of the fencing on trackside left, how it integrates with the grandstand fencing. I have it continuous....and this picture clearly shows it is not.

FYI....everyone. You can pretty much figure I have all the pictures currently posted on the web, particularly those from the History of Riverside website. I've searched Google images a million times and haven't found anything new in months.

In lieu of pictures, if anyone has a good memory enough of the main paddock area and can draw me a "close to it" diagram of the main buildings, fuel pump, any small outbuildings, fencing.....all relative to the S/F flagger box.....even it it's only "relative position to each other" that would help me a ton! Ditto for the main grandstand side of the track. All other track sections I have either good photos of.....or can pick out of the various videos of the 1988 final NASCAR race at RIR. It's just the main straight and pit area that I am really in the dark.....except for estimating based on long shots or extreme angle shots.

Anyone have a photo of the oasis style snack stands/bathrooms buildings RIR put in (I think in the late 70's or early 80's)? They were all identical and I know where they go....just not what they look like in any detail.

Thanks SSB.....keep digin' for those pics!

Tom Pabst

[SSB]

Originally Posted by TomPabst

SSB,

do you guys know Ron Cortez is one of those cars ....I think the 4th car....starting that race?).

Ya he's the one with the rocket fuel.

There was a SS Racer named Ron Christensen, sponsored by Clines Automotive out of Salt Lake City. He had a camera & video set up in his car back in the '80's. Bet he has the best car to track shots on the planet.

From a spectator angle, I have to dig some more.

[Jeff Hail]

Things that outta be but aren't

Grandstands
Named after a local conservationist : The Barbara A. Fine Overlook
Sorry Barb we were here first. Always known as "Grandstands".
Does any remember a Barbara hanging out here? I don't. Sorry Barb you gotta go. I bet she drove an Austin Marina!


East of Skyline
Then we have the Nancy Hoover Pohl Overlook. Must be a pal of Barb? Never heard of Nanc either. I bet Nanc had deep pockets and bought her way in.
The story states: The overlook is named in honor of Fryman canyon resident Nancy Hoover Pohl, who for more than 60 years fought to curb development in the Santa Monica Mountains and to create local parkland. Her efforts enabled the acquisition of Fryman Canyon Park which can be accessed from the overlook.

I just cannot buy into Nancy's overlook story.


Over by Wilt's pad
Then we have have the Stone Canyon Overlook. The story behind this is:
On the south side of Mulholland Drive, the Stone Canyon Overlook was developed in 1994 with funds from the California Department of Transportation Environmental Enhancement and Mitigation Grant Program.

California Department of Transportation Environmental Enhancement and Mitigation Grant Program? Sound's like a politician named this one huh?




Stilts Place
The Universal Overlook.
Story goes:The Universal City Overlook, located on the north side of Mulholland Drive, provides views of the San Fernando Valley and Verdugo Hills. Funded by a donation from Universal studios, it was built in 1984 concurrently with the Hollywood Bowl Overlook further east, to accommodate visitors to Los Angeles during the Summer Olympic Games.

That one is a crock. That little pullout was there long before. It was dirt, then a single paved three car space then in 1984 they doubled it in length. Who makes this crap up? Give em hell Gary!!



Hollywood Bowl Overlook
Another creative attempt to take credit for this. Official LA story:The most easterly of the Conservancy's Scenic Overlooks, the Hollywood Bowl Scenic Overlook is situated to provide a beautiful view of the Hollywood Bowl Amphitheater, downtown Los Angeles, and, on a clear day, the ocean and Catalina Island. To the east, the Hollywood Sign and Griffith Park Observatory are clearly visible, and to the north the San Fernando Valley. The Overlook was built concurrently with Universal City Overlook in 1984 in preparation for the Summer Olympics.

Not!!!!!The Bowl Overlook has been there since the 1950's according to my Mom. It was a dirt lot and was fairly large compared to it today. The little hill gave those surfer vans some privacy. You know the ones with the bumper stickers "don't laugh your daughters in the back" on them.


Dirt Mulholland
LA Conservancy calls it something like the "Groves Overlook"
What the fuh? The Groves? Only thing in groves over there is pea gravel and dead lichen.

[Jeff Hail]

The Barham Bridge
I am ok with that. But did anyone know the original 1956 opening scene of Invasion of the Body Snatchers movie made this bridge infamous in L.A? Also the chase seen at Daronda Drive.

Maybe we should change the name to Charleys Lair?


Why is a bicycle laying there? Sort of takes away the threat of the Neighborhood Watch sign doesn't it?

[Jeff Hail]

Seems they couldn't come up with a name for this one so they left us some dignity........