If you could update your 911 to modern spec...what would you change?

[Rawknees'Turbo]

Buck has almost the same, home built system as I do (similar to Griff's, but components from various suppliers); he should have high 20s vent temps in high 90s ambient, but doesn't have anything close to that. It is a real mystery (all troubleshooting basis covered in the forum over the past two years or so - including lots of input from Griff).

[RarlyL8]

I updated my 911SC, everything modern from the navigation system to the A/C. Xenon headlights and 300hp. Here's what it looks like now:



Yes that's a joke, but really, if you want modern comfort the 996 is a LOT of car for the money.

Mine would be a dynamic exhaust mode so I could hear... anything really... while highway cruising and then listen to sweet dual exhaust music while thrashing the twisties.

I can help you with that. We developed an active exhaust system for the SC/Carrera.

[88911coupe]

Ronnie is right, I have a new compressor, new evaporator from Rennaire, 100% new hoses and fittings, new/additional condenser with powerful fan. original condensers flushed with appropriate cleaner. Have vucuumed down and recharged several times, including taking it to a "professional" AC shop to see if I was doing something wrong....still get, at best, 30 degree drop from ambient at the vents. So, if it's 95 I'll see 65 at the vents. As unlikely as it seems I am wondering if there is anything wrong or out of adjustment with the Rennaire evaporator. Yes, reciever drier new every time. Charlie has suggested there is most likely ambient air in the system but I'm not sure how that could be considering how many times it's been evacuated and recharged. I'm pretty much given up and just drive the GLC 300 99% of the time. Sorry, did not mean to turn this into an ac thread.

[Aurel]

Here is my bucket list of things I would do to upgrade/modernize my SC, if I had unlimited time and budget:

- Porsche classic navigation system/radio
- Modern EFI with PMO ITBs
- Led lights all around, inside and out.
- A faster gearbox, like one form a honda.

[evilfij]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

This. Almost all the things mentioned are in the 964. Unfortunately is just has the ugly bumpers (just my opinion). They do weigh more, but all those options are just mass when not in use.

Get a 993, even more of the good stuff. Or go crazy and get a new GT3.

I will stick to my sorted old 911.

All I really wish were that long hoods were galvanized, if so I would still have one to go with my 993 and 991.2 GT3T. Newer engine technology would be nice too. The 993 is too heavy (it is a C4 cab with power seats) and underpowered, and the GT3T is too heavy and too big. However, not having serious corrosion concerns and having 273 dead reliable air cooled hp and a nice 6 speed , (let alone the GT3 drivetrain which is sublime) in a lightweight beautiful long hood would be excellent. Probably why singers sell for what they do and why backdates are so popular generally.

[Nader]

Two schools of thought on modernizing the 911:

1. Electrification: Make it fast, reliable, clean, and future-proof. Porsche has always been more about the chassis than the drivetrain. Don't think for a minute that Ferry wouldn't have used the Tesla drivetrain if he had access to it in the '60's.

2. Get off my lawn, Millenial!

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by 88911coupe

Ronnie is right, I have a new compressor, new evaporator from Rennaire, 100% new hoses and fittings, new/additional condenser with powerful fan. original condensers flushed with appropriate cleaner. Have vucuumed down and recharged several times, including taking it to a "professional" AC shop to see if I was doing something wrong....still get, at best, 30 degree drop from ambient at the vents. So, if it's 95 I'll see 65 at the vents. As unlikely as it seems I am wondering if there is anything wrong or out of adjustment with the Rennaire evaporator. Yes, reciever drier new every time. Charlie has suggested there is most likely ambient air in the system but I'm not sure how that could be considering how many times it's been evacuated and recharged. I'm pretty much given up and just drive the GLC 300 99% of the time. Sorry, did not mean to turn this into an ac thread.

Charlie knows way more than I do. My way to vacuum the system is one that assumes some moisture in the system just freezes into ice, and sorta "hides" inside. Ice is slow to sublimate. To finally get a rock solid vacuum, I bought a small tank of dry nitrogen, and a regulator setup. I pull a vacuum for several hours, then refill the system with only the dry nitrogen, and even pressurize the system to 150 PSI and let that sit to look for any leaks using soapy water on connections.

Pull another two or three hour vacuum, refill with nitrogen, and let that sit overnight. Then pull another 3 three our vacuum, using fresh oil in the compressor, and then purging every line and connection of the manifold with little refrigerant to be 100% sure there is no air left, recharge the system. I am too chicken to use the liquid refrigerant so I do it all with just the gas, through the low side of course.

It is a belts, suspenders, and still holding on to my belt loops method of recharging.

One other very important item. Double check the evaporator sensor location. I just upgraded my fan motor to the big fan, and had the top of the fan cover off. When I put the sensor back in, I was careful to place it properly, and I used a little dab of thermal paste on the brass tube, and the bulb of the sensor. That really seems to get the temp lower and avoid any freeze up. Before I would get evaporator freeze up if I ran the system on max cold for an hour or two. Now it just cycles off the compressor as needed.

I am driving my 911 to Key West next month. July in Key West is gonna be HOT. And I will have my brother with me, so maximum AC will be needed. I will report back on how it did after the trip.

[echecsqueen]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

To each his own. It is your car, do whatever you want to it.



I live in an area that gets hot and I drive my car to even hotter areas. AC is not just nice, it is a necessity when the heat index is 125.

Plus one ! It is only June and already we are mid 90s and 98 percent humidity. Misery.

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[stlrj]

Maybe update the front suspension to make it handle like the newer water cooled 996's and get rid of that horrendous understeer.

Cheers,

Joe
87 Carrera

[PabloX]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

OK, maybe since I drove a 914 from 1974 to 1996 and my 911 from 1995 to now, the system make total sense to me. Remember the ventilation system for the car was designed in the 1960s. The heat, fresh air and AC are three separate systems and can be run independently or all three at once unlike most cars.

The heat is simple, pull the levers, and adjust the lever to blow on your feet, or the windshield. Same with the fresh air, feet or windshield, but the fan control is from no fan to full blow.

AC, is like any car, on or off and what fan speed, and the other knob is how much cold. You want the fresh air lever on top all the way to the left to prevent fresh outside warm air to dilute the ac cold air.

This will probably be a stupid question but how do I get fresh air?

Anyway, at this point I'd be happy with a windshield washer system that works as well as a full syncromesh transmission.

[porschyard]

PDK with luanch control on one of my 993's would be pretty sweet

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by PabloX

This will probably be a stupid question but how do I get fresh air?



Anyway, at this point I'd be happy with a windshield washer system that works as well as a full syncromesh transmission.

Moved the top lever on the dash sliders. The top lever goes from closed to open an no fan, then 1,2 or 3 on the fan speed. The second lever is left to blow on your feet, right to blow on the windshield, in the middle is a blend from feet or defrost. Nothing will ever blow on you face if you don’t have AC.

[Coastr]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

Back when he was still the big boss, he attended our War Bonnet Tech session in Oklahoma City and he was the keynote speaker one evening. I personally heard him tell the story.

So I was there, and heard it myself from the big man.

This story is pretty well told so I don't think anyone should doubt the veracity.

Not sure if Fuhrmann wanted to kill it. He probably wanted to stick to the plan of 924/928. The SC was supposed to be the last of the series, like the 356SC.

The mid-year foibles seem bad in hindsight but they were nothing compared to the competitions malaise era cars of the day, of which few actually survive. Compared to a 'muscle' car like a trans am or camaro, or even a mid engined exotic, the 911 of the mid '70s was a rocketship built from granite.

But Schutz didn't save it. The buyers did, because they walked straight past the transaxle cars and kept buying the 911 at something like 2x the rate of the 928. Schutz merely recognised the fact that the customer is always right. The development money only went into the convertible and then the new engine. The 928 lived for another 12 years after that.

Ironic, because the 928 has got great AC, is quiet and comfortable while still plenty fast, plenty of space, 'modern' handling....but nobody has yet suggested trading the 911 for a 928!

[PabloX]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

Moved the top lever on the dash sliders. The top lever goes from closed to open an no fan, then 1,2 or 3 on the fan speed. The second lever is left to blow on your feet, right to blow on the windshield, in the middle is a blend from feet or defrost. Nothing will ever blow on you face if you don’t have AC.

I've tried that and I get a lot of noise and a faint breeze.

So I'm going to change my answer above. Like a modern car, I'd change my 911 so fresh air blows on my face from the center vents.

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by Coastr

This story is pretty well told so I don't think anyone should doubt the veracity.

Not sure if Fuhrmann wanted to kill it. He probably wanted to stick to the plan of 924/928. The SC was supposed to be the last of the series, like the 356SC.

The mid-year foibles seem bad in hindsight but they were nothing compared to the competitions malaise era cars of the day, of which few actually survive. Compared to a 'muscle' car like a trans am or camaro, or even a mid engined exotic, the 911 of the mid '70s was a rocketship built from granite.

But Schutz didn't save it. The buyers did, because they walked straight past the transaxle cars and kept buying the 911 at something like 2x the rate of the 928. Schutz merely recognised the fact that the customer is always right. The development money only went into the convertible and then the new engine. The 928 lived for another 12 years after that.

Ironic, because the 928 has got great AC, is quiet and comfortable while still plenty fast, plenty of space, 'modern' handling....but nobody has yet suggested trading the 911 for a 928!

In Schutz's speech he said his predecessor just wanted the 911 gone, but it was still selling well and it could not be just dropped. Fuhrmann forbade any and all R&D money for the 911. Schutz reversed that, and gave them a budget to improve the model. The fastest way to kill a car, is do not let it improve. Keep it static as the competition improves. The Model T was mostly unchanged for years, but that was a very different era.

Originally Posted by PabloX

I've tried that and I get a lot of noise and a faint breeze.

So I'm going to change my answer above. Like a modern car, I'd change my 911 so fresh air blows on my face from the center vents.

Different thing. Yep the factory designed fresh air is a total joke. You need an AC system to get air on your face. There are mods and lots of threads on this site on how to change your fresh air system to blow through the center vents, but it will still suck with that little fan. AC is your best bet.

[Rawknees'Turbo]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

. . . Yep the factory designed fresh air is a total joke. You need an AC system to get air on your face. There are mods and lots of threads on this site on how to change your fresh air system to blow through the center vents, but it will still suck with that little fan. AC is your best bet.

Yep, and in fact, I made mine completely inop by making a blocking plate out of thin metal and installing that under the intake screen (completely unnoticeable when painted flat black) - really cut down on the amount of nasty, Texass air that enters the cabin at highway speeds (only supercooled air for me - none of that hot, humid, gross stuff needed)!

[PabloX]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

Different thing. Yep the factory designed fresh air is a total joke. You need an AC system to get air on your face. There are mods and lots of threads on this site on how to change your fresh air system to blow through the center vents, but it will still suck with that little fan. AC is your best bet.

Yes. Understood. I've owned my 86 for almost 10 years and the AC belt has never been on it. I suppose I should get it going (I even have a tank of R12) but where I am, it's rare that I actually need it.

[MadeofOak]

Parts availability like a new car. It sucks paying $25 USD for shipping for every little thing.

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by PabloX

Yes. Understood. I've owned my 86 for almost 10 years and the AC belt has never been on it. I suppose I should get it going (I even have a tank of R12) but where I am, it's rare that I actually need it.

That is when it comes down to your decision making. Even with no compressor, you can run the AC evaporator motor and blow cabin temp air on you. That helps if you are already sweaty. At autocrosses I use a switch I installed to kill the compressor, and I run the evaporator fan to blow on me.

Open the fresh air and divert it to the floor, and run the AC fan at max, and you get some air blowing on you and that does help me.

To replace your AC hoses, new dryer, and new compressor and likely replace the evaporator would get you fairly stock AC. It is lots better than none. Talk to Charlie, tell him what you have, and where you want to go. It is far from cheap, but he makes a great product.

For me, it was without a doubt the best improvement ever for my 911, and I have done many improvements.

It is your car, drive it and enjoy it. If you find yourself not driving it becasue it is hot outside, fix that issue, and get to driving!

[rennch]

Lots of AC in this thread, The Classic Retrofit is a great kit.


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