After 21 years... she's leaving

[porsche4life]

Originally Posted by LeeH

Yeah, so far all I've done is stare at it. Trying to figure out the least expensive/invasive path. I think the best thing I've come up with is to put the TV in the center partially covering the fireplace, then put the center speaker inside the fireplace with some sort of cover just inside the tile surround.

I think I can find a chest or shelves of some sort to sit in the box where the TV is currently located.

Sidney, if you get over this way let me know and you can come stare at it and throw out ideas.

I'll let you know. I bet we can figure it out. Get Jeff in on it too, bet we can at least get it all torn up for you!

[livi]

Really sorry to hear this, Lee. I hope you find your way.

[UconnTim97]

Originally Posted by porsche4life

**** Tim. I didn't know that! Sorry to hear it.

No worries. I kept it quiet for a while. Most likely first time I mentioned it here.

I was embarrassed and felt like a failure at first. That caused me to make the mistake of hiding from my support system of great friends. Seeing a good counsellor definitely helped with that.

As Jake and others have said, seeing a counsellor during a divorce works wonders.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

She says that now but I bet once she gets an attorney involved she'll change her tune. No lawyer is going to let their client leave tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars in equity on the table. I've seen this happen far too many times with people close to me - it always starts as "amicable" and the moment lawyers get involved it becomes a schyteshow. Remember lawyers only get paid when they're fighting and arguing (or more specifically when their clients are). They have absolutely nothing to gain by seeing you settle amicably and will likely goad you both into making things as contentious as possible to maximize billable hours.

I hope you've lawyered up already. If not, don't wait. Get a good one and document EVERYTHING she says about not being interested in the house, etc. Get it in writing if you can - then you might have a shot. At the end of the day (since you're male) expect you'll lose the house, kids, half your savings and likely your retirement. Sorry, I've seen this happen more times than I can count and I've been dragged in to testify twice at divorce cases that went all the way to trial. It sucks for everyone involved and even those only peripherally involved. All she has to do if things get contentious enough is hint at the word "abuse" and your life will be turned into a hell you can't even begin to comprehend.

Accept the fact that as a male, you're automatically wrong, you're an inherently bad person, you obviously did something wrong, you're probably abusive, you automatically treated the perfect little princess like crap and you deserve to lose everything you have - and you will. Use those as your guiding principles to set your expectations so you won't be let down. Then maybe you'll be able to get some closure at some point. I hate to say it but expect things to get nasty - they will. Finally, after a couple of years of living hell and financial armageddon, you might be able to move on. Don't be ridiculous - get out of the house now, sell everything you possibly can, start living as poorly as you can and for heaven's sake get a lawyer involved pronto who MIGHT be able to do something for you.

Sorry to be a downer at a vulnerable time but I see realism as a necessary thing sometimes. This is a craptastic situation for sure and I've seen it happen too often - girl wakes up one day and says out of the blue "I want something else" and gets kids, house, cars, free money and the guy gets shell-shocked and blasted into financial oblivion. The outcome has been the same in every single case I've seen, with a few variations on just how bad it got for them.

I'm really sorry to hear that yet another one of our brothers here has been dragged into this fustercluck abortion of justice known as the "family law" system.

[steveo12345]

Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile

She says that now but I bet once she gets an attorney involved she'll change her tune. No lawyer is going to let their client leave tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars in equity on the table. I've seen this happen far too many times with people close to me - it always starts as "amicable" and the moment lawyers get involved it becomes a schyteshow. Remember lawyers only get paid when they're fighting and arguing (or more specifically when their clients are). They have absolutely nothing to gain by seeing you settle amicably and will likely goad you both into making things as contentious as possible to maximize billable hours.

I hope you've lawyered up already. If not, don't wait. Get a good one and document EVERYTHING she says about not being interested in the house, etc. Get it in writing if you can - then you might have a shot. At the end of the day (since you're male) expect you'll lose the house, kids, half your savings and likely your retirement. Sorry, I've seen this happen more times than I can count and I've been dragged in to testify twice at divorce cases that went all the way to trial. It sucks for everyone involved and even those only peripherally involved. All she has to do if things get contentious enough is hint at the word "abuse" and your life will be turned into a hell you can't even begin to comprehend.

Accept the fact that as a male, you're automatically wrong, you're an inherently bad person, you obviously did something wrong, you're probably abusive, you automatically treated the perfect little princess like crap and you deserve to lose everything you have - and you will. Use those as your guiding principles to set your expectations so you won't be let down. Then maybe you'll be able to get some closure at some point. I hate to say it but expect things to get nasty - they will. Finally, after a couple of years of living hell and financial armageddon, you might be able to move on. Don't be ridiculous - get out of the house now, sell everything you possibly can, start living as poorly as you can and for heaven's sake get a lawyer involved pronto who MIGHT be able to do something for you.

Sorry to be a downer at a vulnerable time but I see realism as a necessary thing sometimes. This is a craptastic situation for sure and I've seen it happen too often - girl wakes up one day and says out of the blue "I want something else" and gets kids, house, cars, free money and the guy gets shell-shocked and blasted into financial oblivion. The outcome has been the same in every single case I've seen, with a few variations on just how bad it got for them.

I'm really sorry to hear that yet another one of our brothers here has been dragged into this fustercluck abortion of justice known as the "family law" system.

Everything said here is 100% correct. I speak from experience.

[sc_rufctr]

^^^ All good but if you do get a lawyer don't "scream it from the roof tops".

That alone may be threatening to her. Certainly engage one to start putting your affairs in order but try to keep it discreet & nonthreatening.
At some point she'll find out but hopeful enough time has passed so that she doesn't panic.

This is important. Your lawyer works for you. Make sure they understand that and listen to them but think before you act.
No one know your ex better than you.

And YES start documenting everything. Buy yourself a small note book and start writing things down.
Just keep it simple. Date, time and what was said/agreed to.

[LeeH]

Originally Posted by steveo12345

Everything said here is 100% correct. I speak from experience.

I really don't see it going that way for a variety of reasons that I won't catalog here.

[sc_rufctr]

Originally Posted by LeeH

I really don't see it going that way for a variety of reasons that I won't catalog here.

Expect the best but plan for the worst.

My ex did all manner of things I never expected during our divorce. Long and complicated but basically I didn't recognize the person she became.

It was like an Alien had swapped out her brain.

[porsche4life]

Originally Posted by LeeH

I really don't see it going that way for a variety of reasons that I won't catalog here.

I wouldn't put much stock into what Jeff says. Any time Thuy reads his posts from a woman's perspective she just rolls her eyes, and I tend to agree.


And in Thuy's case she did leave cash on the table against her lawyers wishes because not turning her ex into a bitter ass wasn't worth it. Guess what, now we have a civil adult relationship with him. He and I can have discussions and are cool with each other, hell I represented him when he bought a house.

People can act like adults if you treat them like it. If you go in expecting a fight. Guess what you get.



I know Lee and his wife fairly well, I think they will make it work.

[porsche4life]

Originally Posted by UconnTim97

No worries. I kept it quiet for a while. Most likely first time I mentioned it here.

I was embarrassed and felt like a failure at first. That caused me to make the mistake of hiding from my support system of great friends. Seeing a good counsellor definitely helped with that.

As Jake and others have said, seeing a counsellor during a divorce works wonders.

Just feel like I should have put the pieces together on Facebook! Your daughter is adorable by the way!


And yes Thuy always tells people to see a counselor. She went quite a bit before and during her divorce. It messes with your head, good to talk it through with someone.

[KFC911]

Originally Posted by sc_rufctr

Expect the best but plan for the worst.

My ex did all manner of things I never expected during our divorce. Long and complicated but basically I didn't recognize the person she became.

It was like an Alien had swapped out her brain.

Very sorry Lee...I've seen it way too often to family and friends. Yes it CAN happen, though it's not a given as POP states. She's blindsided you once ....CYA and get on with your life....best of luck!

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by sc_rufctr

Expect the best but plan for the worst.

My ex did all manner of things I never expected during our divorce. Long and complicated but basically I didn't recognize the person she became.

It was like an Alien had swapped out her brain.

This happened both times to me.

Wife #1 ran off with another guy. She fought the divorce! All she did was run up the legal bills. - Aside, she ran off with another married man. The two of them "thought" they could push his wife out of the house and she would become the new mommy.

Wife #2 and I were unhappy and stressed out. She had a serious drinking problem that she semi-admitted, but wouldn't treat. The decision to end it was mutual and "friendly". We were together for 3 weeks while arranging everything. Sex was GREAT! We even slept together a couple of times a week post split, for a few months. She met a guy and everything changed. She made it VERY tough to get her served with the divorce papers. She told terrible stories to her family and friends. In the legal negotiations, when we were left alone, she told me she "faked it" every-time. This is the legal crazy time.

Once divorce was over, her sanity returned. She would would call once of twice a week to talk, get advice, etc. She trusted me.

After divorce #2, I did a lot of introspection. I obviously chose two different crazy women. I needed to look in myself to make better choices.

[RANDY P]

Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile

She says that now but I bet once she gets an attorney involved she'll change her tune. No lawyer is going to let their client leave tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars in equity on the table. I've seen this happen far too many times with people close to me - it always starts as "amicable" and the moment lawyers get involved it becomes a schyteshow. Remember lawyers only get paid when they're fighting and arguing (or more specifically when their clients are). They have absolutely nothing to gain by seeing you settle amicably and will likely goad you both into making things as contentious as possible to maximize billable hours.

I hope you've lawyered up already. If not, don't wait. Get a good one and document EVERYTHING she says about not being interested in the house, etc. Get it in writing if you can - then you might have a shot. At the end of the day (since you're male) expect you'll lose the house, kids, half your savings and likely your retirement. Sorry, I've seen this happen more times than I can count and I've been dragged in to testify twice at divorce cases that went all the way to trial. It sucks for everyone involved and even those only peripherally involved. All she has to do if things get contentious enough is hint at the word "abuse" and your life will be turned into a hell you can't even begin to comprehend.

Accept the fact that .......

Originally Posted by steveo12345

Everything said here is 100% correct. I speak from experience.

Originally Posted by sc_rufctr

^^^ All good but if you do get a lawyer don't "scream it from the roof tops".

.....
Just keep it simple. Date, time and what was said/agreed to.

Originally Posted by red-beard

This happened both times to me.

Wife #1 ran off with another guy. She fought the divorce! All she did was run up the legal bills. - Aside, she ran off with another married man. The two of them "thought" they could push his wife out of the house and she would become the new mommy.

Wife #2 and I were unhappy and stressed out. She had a serious drinking problem that she semi-admitted, but wouldn't treat. The decision to end it was mutual and "friendly". We were together for 3 weeks while arranging everything. Sex was GREAT! We even ..

It's amazing how a woman's mind and opinion can change overnight once she's convinced she can gain something, and you've fallen out of favor. Guilt doesn't exist for most of them.

Many are generally as faithful as their options.

rjp

[notfarnow]

Originally Posted by LeeH

I really don't see it going that way for a variety of reasons that I won't catalog here.

Neither did I.

Discretely getting a lawyer is REALLY good advice. I didn't expect things to get adversarial, but when it did go that route she was prepared, armed and had a strategy. I was blindsided and did not have the time, bandwidth or resources to react.

We were on a very cooperative, even keeled path initially. But as time went on, her "support system" was to a large degree, jaded divorcees who had been around the block. I didn't see the change in approach coming, and I wasn't prepared for it. Because I wanted to remain amiable, I continued to try to meet her half (or partway) on everything, even as her expectations become more and more unreasonable.

By the time things were coming to signatures last fall, I was worn down and struggling to manage 2 mortgages, 2 homes, support payments while still managing to float my business. I just wanted it done. If I'd engaged my own lawyer earlier, I'm sure he/she would have guided me much better.

Essentially, I got gutted financially because I was not prepared. My ex is the very last person you would have expected to see take that tack. We are close now and co-parent very well, but in my mind that's because I just decided not to harbour resentment. She refers to it as a "rough time" that she's embarassed about, in retrospect.

[jhynesrockmtn]

It's amazing how a woman's mind and opinion can change overnight once she's convinced she can gain something, and you've fallen out of favor. Guilt doesn't exist for most of them.

I'll offer a different perspective. Not all women are out to get you, not all courts and lawyers treat men like dirt and states have different laws and processes. For those who went through that experience, sorry to hear it. My experience was different and I've heard a ton more anectodal stories about men who cheated, lied and stole from their spouses.

I hired a lawyer trained in amicable (uncontested) divorce. Now, we started with nothing so all was marital property. She had her own lawyer but both were trained in this process. We split all down the middle and I paid a reasonable spousal support as the main $ earner for a few years. Took a while to figure out because we had a decent retirement nest egg and several rental properties. She stayed in the marital home, I moved into one of the rentals, kids and dogs went back and forth week to week. Legal costs were about $5,000. If it had gone south during the process I had my attorney, she had hers. To this day we are friends, kids eventually got through it and we are in many ways still a family who attend events together, support each other, etc.

Best of luck.

[Crowbob]

Originally Posted by notfarnow

Neither did I.

Discretely getting a lawyer is REALLY good advice. I didn't expect things to get adversarial, but when it did go that route she was prepared, armed and had a strategy. I was blindsided and did not have the time, bandwidth or resources to react.

We were on a very cooperative, even keeled path initially. But as time went on, her "support system" was to a large degree, jaded divorcees who had been around the block. I didn't see the change in approach coming, and I wasn't prepared for it. Because I wanted to remain amiable, I continued to try to meet her half (or partway) on everything, even as her expectations become more and more unreasonable.

By the time things were coming to signatures last fall, I was worn down and struggling to manage 2 mortgages, 2 homes, support payments while still managing to float my business. I just wanted it done. If I'd engaged my own lawyer earlier, I'm sure he/she would have guided me much better.

Essentially, I got gutted financially because I was not prepared. My ex is the very last person you would have expected to see take that tack. We are close now and co-parent very well, but in my mind that's because I just decided not to harbour resentment. She refers to it as a "rough time" that she's embarassed about, in retrospect.

Is she embarrassed enough to offer a refund?

[Crowbob]

Originally Posted by jhynesrockmtn

I'll offer a different perspective. Not all women are out to get you, not all courts and lawyers treat men like dirt and states have different laws and processes. For those who went through that experience, sorry to hear it. My experience was different and I've heard a ton more anectodal stories about men who cheated, lied and stole from their spouses.

I hired a lawyer trained in amicable (uncontested) divorce. Now, we started with nothing so all was marital property. She had her own lawyer but both were trained in this process. We split all down the middle and I paid a reasonable spousal support as the main $ earner for a few years. Took a while to figure out because we had a decent retirement nest egg and several rental properties. She stayed in the marital home, I moved into one of the rentals, kids and dogs went back and forth week to week. Legal costs were about $5,000. If it had gone south during the process I had my attorney, she had hers. To this day we are friends, kids eventually got through it and we are in many ways still a family who attend events together, support each other, etc.

Best of luck.

Good for you that she chose to be reasonable. Had she gone to war, my guess is you'd be singing a far different tune. In addition, the marital assets sound like they were sufficient to be divided leaving both parties financially viable.

However, your situation does nothing to support your assertion that the courts are even remotely fair. The court and its players had absolutely nothing to do with your good resolution. You need to be thanking your lucky stars.

[notfarnow]

Originally Posted by Crowbob

Is she embarrassed enough to offer a refund?

To her eternal credit, yes. For a portion of it. Once everything was settled and she did the math, she came back to me after realizing to what degree she had been favored. By that point lawyers had soaked up a lot of it anyway, but it meant a lot to me to at least have it acknowledged

[Por_sha911]

Originally Posted by notfarnow

jaded divorcees who had been around the block.

Pelicans?

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Originally Posted by Moses

Sorry to hear your bad news. But you will find the RIGHT one in time.

Interestingly, 2/3 of divorces in California are initiated by women. But post-divorce measures of happiness give the edge to men. By a large margin.

Employed, kind, single men are unicorns in the dating world. It's way too early to be mentioning this, but your options will be limitless.

I've heard that statistic is national (not just limited to CA) and more like 70%. It couldn't have anything at all to do with the fact that divorce laws and courts are unquestionably and unabashedly biased towards women, could it?

Naaaaaaaahhhhhh.